Every Bodily Function

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Hey, everyone, Welcome to season
four of The Shit That Happens to Me

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Podcast. I'm your host, Stacy
Nie. I've been away for a while.

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Did you miss me? I really
missed you all so much. I

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was on a little hiatus doing another
podcast called Psychoanalyzing the Patient, which was

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a companion podcast to the Hulu show
The Patient. It was so much fun

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with my co host Lindsey Jones.
We hope to be doing more in the

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near future, so stay tuned for
that. But now let's talk about some

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shit. Emmy Award winning sound designer
and sound effects editor James David Reading the

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Third is on the show today.
You may know him from shows like The

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Americans and The Queen's Gambit. I
met James when he was a guest on

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Psychoanalyzing the Patient. He has done
numerous shows and films in the past,

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and I was thrilled that he was
willing to talk to me today for episod

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SO seventy five, Season four of
The Shit That Happens to Me Podcast.

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He tells us some really interesting stories
today, like about how they get the

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sound effects of bodily functions on different
shows, and how the sound of a

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t rex made us way into a
very serious documentary. So just a reminder,

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subscribe, rate, and review this
podcast, The Shit that Happens to

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Me Podcast, Share with your friends, tell everyone you know, and now

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onto the show. Shit happens,
bad shit, good shit, crazy shit,

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and it usually happens when we least
expect it. So tuned into The

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Shit that Happens to Me Podcast and
hear me and everyone I meet tell their

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shitty stories. You'll laugh, you'll
cry. You probably won't cry. Why

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would you cry? These are mostly
funny stories. You'll learn a few lessons,

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probably not. It's definitely not that
kind of podcast, but you will

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have a great time. Honestly,
you can't make this shit up. Hi,

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everyone, welcome back to the Ship
that Happens to Me Podcast. We

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are back after a brief hiatus while
I had a little fun on the side

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doing a new podcast called Psychoanalyzing the
Patient, which is a Hulu show.

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The Patient did a companion podcast for
that, so if you haven't listened to

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that, you should definitely go check
that out after you listen to me today.

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So for our seventy fifth episode,
I've been doing this podcast for three

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over three years. Seventy five episodes
I have on Emmy Award winning sound designer

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and sound effects editor James David reading
the third. I am so excited to

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have him here. He has worked
on some of my favorite television shows,

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including The Queen's Gambit, The Americans, Thirty Rock, Alaska Daily, and

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most recently The Patient. So James
was a guest on Psychoanalyzing the Patient and

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hinted during that conversation that he had
many crazy stories to tell. So I

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reached out and here he is.
Welcome, James, thank you, thank

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you for having me. Stacy.
How you doing today? Doing pretty good?

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You know. I've had a couple
of weeks off, which has been

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nice to sort of regroup. I
haven't had a break in about a year,

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so it was kind of nice to
sort of regroup and refresh and everything.

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And I actually go back into the
studio tomorrow for a couple of days

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to do another episode of Alaska Daily. Really, I'm so excited because I

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was watching that show and then it
ended and it was on a cliffhanger,

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I might add, so it's coming
back. Yeah, that was the mid

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season break. I think they start
airing new episodes in February. They're finishing

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shooting now. I think actually they
finished last week. They finished shooting and

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we're doing episode seven of season one
starting tomorrow, and then we'll finish up

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the season in January and February,
just as the new episodes start airing.

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So oh good, I'm so excited. I'm also I'm going to Alaska in

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July, so I'm really appreciating also, just like you know, the location

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and everything, so that's great.
Alaska is Alaska is gorgeous. I have

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family that lives in Fairbanks, and
I went when I was in high school

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and it is such an amazing place
to me. We got to go hiking

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and climbed up mountains, and my
cousins have these what they call campsites,

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but they have log cabins on them, but they're miles outside of civilization,

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just in the woods, and the
only way to get to one of their

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cabins is via riverboat, and the
other one you can only get to via

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a TV. And it was is
such a cool experience. So oh it

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sounds wonderful. I can't wait.
Thank you, thank you. So um.

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Maybe first you can tell the listeners
exactly what a sound designer and sound

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effects editor does sure. So when
you watch any sort of media, especially

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with picture, all the sounds in
there are somehow controlled, and part of

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my job is controlling those sounds.
On a television show, the only thing

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that is captured live, or the
only thing that they're trying to capture live,

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is the dialogue from the actor's performance. But everything else we pretty much

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add in afterwards, including ambiances,
birds, wind, leaves, water,

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We put in all the door opens
and closes, cars running, you know,

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dogs barking outside, dogs barking inside. We control all of that,

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and by sound design, we're designing
the way that audio affects your visualization.

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Audio plays a big part in our
perception of the world, and we're sort

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of manipulating that so that you believe
that this fake world on television is real,

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and so that that's probably the easiest
way I can explain it without sort

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of getting too technical and getting too
audio geeky. Well, I mean,

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I don't. I didn't know anything
about audio, and I am still not

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an expert at all, not even
a novice, But I was really fascinated

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to hear about all the ways in
which audio is added after the fact.

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So one of the stories that you
told us well. One of the questions

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that I asked you about being on
the patient was all of the times that

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I'm sorry to bring this up again, but it's I think one of the

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funny things to talk about is how
Donald Gleason kept going into the bathroom and

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peeing, and so we were asking
about did he really pee in the toilet?

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How did you get that sound of
peeing in the toilet? And that

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was all added afterwards in various different
ways. Some of it wasn't even peeing

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correct correct the peace sound for the
patient. Some of it was peen.

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None of it was Donald's peen.
None of it was done on set.

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It was all done afterwards. There's
recordings that I have from around my house.

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My daughter and I also took a
bucket of water and poured it slowly

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into a toilet to get the sound. There's other sound libraries that had peen

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in it. And really what it
came down to with, especially with the

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patient, was getting the fuel right
for the fact that he would walk into

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another room, close the door and
go into a bathroom behind that door,

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and it wasn't that he was walking
into a bathroom. He was walking into

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a bedroom that had on suite off
the side, So it was trying to

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get the right feel for that a
distance as far as and going through a

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door. And then there was also
the whole fact of that the jay's for

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the show. The show runners for
the show UM wanted it to be sort

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of an extended as they used to
call it, a young man's pee,

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because that was part of the story. And so we had to nail down

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the right length of how long it
was going to be. We had to

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nail down the right flow to say
that it was a young person and such

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like that. So we most of
it was recorded and then cut in later.

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That That was one of my jobs
was recording and cutting in different ways

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of peeing sounds, and we didn't
use the same one each time. I

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will admit that we didn't use the
same recording each time because we wanted different

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lengths just to play with time in
there, and also just to give different

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perspectives sometimes so that it wasn't like, oh, they're just using the same

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sound over and over again, because
your brain does pick up on that.

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In a television show, you sort
of and sometimes you want that sometimes you

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want to set up like, oh, it's the same sound because it's being

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used as a marker, right,
And we did do that with the P

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as far as timing of the P
because that was a device in the show

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that we used to play with time
episode six. And so sometimes you want

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to be the same thing, sometimes
you don't. And to me, I

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always like sort of refreshing the sounds
and having not exactly the same but similar.

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So I probably recorded myself just for
that show at least thirty different urination

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type sounds. What thirty different urination
type sounds? That's a lot, and

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how many compared to some things that
I record. Some things I record like

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doors. I have so many different
sounds of doors, because you just never

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know what's going to fit right for
what you need. So tell me then,

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like what's some crazy things that happen
or what could go terribly wrong,

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or you know, tell me some
disasters or something. Sure, well,

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usually you know, most disasters that
are worth telling and happen with other people.

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I find disasters that happen to yourself
are just sort of sad a little

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bit to myself. That's how I
always feel about it. So usually the

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disasters that come about with other things
are usually in the realm of adr which

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I'm assuming most people don't know what
that is, but that is automated dialogue

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replacement, which we go and replace
dialogue in a scene from a show or

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a movie. And it could be
before technical reasons. You know, if

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they were filming outside of an airport
and an airplane flew overhead and you couldn't

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hear the actor, but their facial
expressions were right, we just want to

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replace their voice. Or it could
be for story reasons. We need to

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change something in the story, character's
name, or the time that was mentioned

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or a date that was mentioned,
so we'll replace them and have the actor

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come into a studio and give us
that line again with a slight change,

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or just for the technical reasons.
And usually, you know, some funny

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things can happen during that time.
You know, you can have the actors

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have to get back into you know, say their character has been running well,

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now we have to get them winded
again, so you have to ask

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them to run in place or do
some exercise. I had one actor come

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in that was doing voiceover for a
documentary and they knew that their stomach grumbled

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a lot, and they feel bad
about that because the stomach grumble will ruin

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a take, and so they came
in. They actually have a pillow that

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they always brought. I thought this
was the sweetest thing because they were really

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excited about doing the voice over and
they took this pill and they would put

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it over their stomach to quiet their
stomach well so that you wouldn't hear it

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on the microphone. But we've also
had some you know, terrific horror stories

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where and it's by no fault of
anybody in the session. It's just circumstance.

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When we ask actors to do their
job, we're asking them to be

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very vulnerable. We're asking them to
portray a character and portray that person sort

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of inner being that you know,
we're putting them in a very vulnerable state.

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And sometimes it's really hard for them
to get back to that state,

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especially if they've shot you know,
months ago, and now they have to

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come back and redo it. And
so I've had actors come in and just

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completely break down because they feel like
they can't get back to the spot that

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they need to. I've had them, you know, they're trying, and

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sometimes we do multiple takes, right
we'll you know, you would love to

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get it in maybe three takes,
but most the time, you know.

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I've had one time where I was
shooting an ADR with an actor and one

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line took twenty five takes. Oh, because they have to get the sound

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of their voice back, they need
to get the emotion back to where it

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needs to be. They're trying to
get it back and sync with their own

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lips so that we believe that it's
actually happening on screen. And so you're

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you're putting them in this vulnerable place
and for all intensive purposes. They are

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in a fish bowl. They're in
a soundproof booth that has a glass window,

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and everybody is looking at them through
this window. So they're just sort

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of buy themselves in this space,
and we keep asking them for more and

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more, and so I've seen some
people just break down where they've completely lost

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it. I had one actor who
after a long day of shooting, they

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put in probably a twelve hour day
on set and then had to come and

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do about four hours of ADR afterwards
for a previous episode of a TV show.

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They were not having it. And
there's nothing quite like somebody that you

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don't really know. You know the
character because you've seen them so often,

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but you don't really know the person, and they come in and they're tired

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and they're just in a bad mood. And this one actor came in.

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We were connected with studio across the
country and the producers were on the line

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for the connection and the actor came
in. I said, oh, the

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mic is live so that you can
immediately start talking with the studio execs.

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And they walk in. They just
start going, fuck you, you fucking

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fucks. I'm fucking tired and I'm
fucking tired of this shit. I cannot

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deal with this. And they're like, hey, how's it going, body,

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and I'm like, he can't hear
you yet. He hasn't put on

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the headphones and they're like oh,
and he's still going off. And then

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he finally puts on the headphones and
they're like, hey, how's it going.

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He goes fuck you and he throws
the headphones and walks out. We

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were like, hey, you know, we'll get through this. And I'm

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like he walked out. Yeah,
he coming back, and I'm like,

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I don't know, and the like
nope, Like I'm not gonna go chase

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after somebody that that's that's that angry, you know. I had one time

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where Uh, an actor and a
director just did not get along at all.

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And um they the actor came in
to fulfill their adr obligation, but

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did not make it easy. And
they fought every line, and they,

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you know, wanted reasoning for why
are we doing this line? Why?

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And most of the lines were they
were all it was nothing to do with

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performance. It was all technical reasons. There was a noise that we couldn't

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get rid of, that we needed
to get rid of, and uh,

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yeah, it was just it was
a it was a four hour fight to

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get them to reproduce a line.
So this is something new that I'm learning

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again that So you might have an
actor do let's say ten minutes of dialogue

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and you're telling me that there might
be a minute of it in the middle

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that something I don't know, a
glass dropped or something like that, and

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so you have to just rerecord that
one minute of dialogue and then you have

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to stick it in or are you
just going to do the whole ten minutes

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again or you don't know yet,
We don't know yet. Usually if they've

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shot it on set, if it's
something like a long monologue or something like

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that, hopefully they have multiple takes
that they did on set, and hopefully

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we can just take one of those
other takes and take the word that is

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getting obstructed and fix it. That
is the best case scenario. Otherwise we

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will have the actor come into the
booth and rerecord, and we try to

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get as little as possible to fix. It's also just for ease for the

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actor, but sometimes in order to
make it believable, we have to get

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what we call handles a little bit
on either side of the problem so that

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we can blend it easier. Part
of it so that the actor can get

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back into the character and get into
the flow of how they were talking.

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And part of it also is just
for sonically, for us to use our

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tools to manipulate it so that it
matches better. So hopefully we don't have

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to do the full ten minutes.
Again, yeah, for everybody's stake.

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But and even even if we do
the full ten minutes, we sometimes whittle

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it down to just taking Sometimes we
just take syllables to fix things. Huh

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Okay. And then you said that
they're like in a sound booth all by

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themselves doing this, so they are
not I mean, might they be with

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their co star or something? Or
no, Nope, at this point that

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it's it's just them just because we're
trying to get their dialogue as clean as

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possible. Okay, so we try
not Sometimes depending on the ADR stage,

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sometimes the director and mixer might be
in the same room with them and not

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looking at them through a piece of
glass. But it is just them reacting

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to what has already been shot on
screen. So they're listening to the scene

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as it was shot and they're trying
to respond to it as they did on

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set, just to replace a line
of dialogue. And so you call this

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their ADR obligation. So they know
when they are chosen to be in a

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film or a TV show that this
is almost inevitable correct, depending on their

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contract. In most cases, usually
the contract does stipulate that they have to

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do be obligated to do some ADR
if necessary. It's not like if everything

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went down fine and we were able
to fix it all, then they don't

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have to do any AD. Yeah, you know, and that's what we

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really try to go for. Oh, that's what most of us strive for

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because of the fact that it's usually
a better performance that way if we can

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fix it. You know, everybody
always likes what happens on set. It's

240
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also technically just usually better because they're
in the same space as the lines.

241
00:19:18.440 --> 00:19:23.920
Yeah, yeah, so it works
better technically sonically for you. Yeah,

242
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And I would think it would just
be more authentic. And you know,

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I'm just imagining, like you have
to match up, like the words with

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the way their mouth is moving and
because they might do it differently the second

245
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time. And wow, that is
really I mean, obviously that's really technical.

246
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Some actors do see it as a
good way of improving their performance,

247
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right, because sometimes they feel like, oh, I could have hit that

248
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note a little bit better as far
as you know, timing and stuff like

249
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that. And as far as sync, we do have some leeway with how

250
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we can manipulate the syllables to make
them match up with the voice with the

251
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lips. So sometimes sync is not
as important as much as the motion.

252
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But there's so many parts that can
play because then what's even gets even trickier.

253
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Is all right, So now we've
done the adr, we've recorded it,

254
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we've edited it in, we've mixed
it in, and now we have

255
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to show it to the director or
the producer or whoever has the final approval.

256
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And sometimes just because they know that
we've done it. They go,

257
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oh, that's a d R.
I don't like it, and you're like,

258
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well, because and it's more of
a psychole lot. Sometimes it's a

259
00:20:32.640 --> 00:20:36.960
psychological game. Sometimes it is it
doesn't doesn't work right. But sometimes it's

260
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just like they know that it was
done. And there have been plenty of

261
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times too where we're like, we
know you shot a DR for this,

262
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but we didn't use it and so
this is actually production. They're like,

263
00:20:45.039 --> 00:20:48.640
oh, okay, play for me
again. UM. So sometimes it's a

264
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psychological thing of like they know that
it was done, so they're you know,

265
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they're wary of it. They're they're
thinking something might be wrong. It's

266
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the same thing with um with lip
sync, if one somebody notices something out

267
00:21:00.640 --> 00:21:06.400
of lip sync, you have to
work really hard to make sure that it's

268
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not out of sync. But then
it's almost always in your mind as being

269
00:21:10.480 --> 00:21:12.640
out of sync because it was a
problem, you know, and it's it's

270
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one of those instinctual things that happens
to us as humans, is you know,

271
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it's how we learn not to play
with fire. Right, we touched

272
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fire, it hurt, don't touch
it again. It's like it was out

273
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of like, here's a problem.
The sync was a problem, and it's

274
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going to be a problem in this
spot every time in our brain, you

275
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know, and sometimes it's hard to
get over that. You sort of have

276
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to like step away for a little
bit, come back, and then watch

277
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it again sort of fresh. Okay. So one of the other things that's

278
00:21:41.680 --> 00:21:45.839
that's sort of fun about being a
sound designer is the recording process, right

279
00:21:47.200 --> 00:21:51.400
is going out and recording peeing or
whatever else. I worked on a project

280
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one time where in order to make
the sound that we want to make,

281
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which was an explosion with glass debris, we went around and at this time

282
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I was actually living in Los Angeles. We went around two Junkyards around the

283
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Greater Los Angeles area. And this
was in the nineties, so there was

284
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still tube televisions, the big tube
televisions, and so we went around to

285
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Junkyards in the nineties and bought twenty
seven inch or bigger tube televisions. I

286
00:22:22.240 --> 00:22:26.240
think the biggest one we got was
only thirty two or thirty six inches or

287
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something like that, and we bought
I think twelve of them from Junkyards and

288
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we took them back to a folly
stage, which is a soundproof room where

289
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footsteps and other sound effects can be
performed to picture, and we took them

290
00:22:44.000 --> 00:22:47.359
back to the folly stage and we
took the plastic casing off of them.

291
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And our folly artist for the project
had learned that if you laid the television

292
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down with the glass side, the
viewing side down and through some thing at

293
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the back tube of the television,
it made the best implosion because the glass

294
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would break and then the vacuum would
fill up and it would implode, and

295
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plus all the glass would go down
instead of sprain all over. Yeah.

296
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So we set up a television in
a pit in the fully room, and

297
00:23:17.359 --> 00:23:21.279
we put up these big baffles around
the television just to protect ourselves, these

298
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foot foot thick foam baffles sound baffles, and we hung microphones over it all

299
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around. We hung I think about
eight microphones around because we had different recorders

300
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recording at different levels just in case, and the fully artist would jump up

301
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on a step stool over the baffle, throw a brick at the television and

302
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then duck so that nothing would just
in case something went wrong, and we

303
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recorded I would say nine televisions this
way, each one having a different type

304
00:23:55.599 --> 00:24:02.759
of concussive boom with glass. And
then I guess, like the last one

305
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that we did, so number twelve, he goes up and it was just

306
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a twenty seven It was the smallest
one we had, a twenty seven inch

307
00:24:11.519 --> 00:24:15.599
goes up, throws the brick at
it, and the implosion. I always

308
00:24:15.599 --> 00:24:18.720
want to say explosion because that's what
we used the sound for it. But

309
00:24:18.759 --> 00:24:25.599
the implosion of the television was such
a concussive sound. It actually shook everything

310
00:24:26.079 --> 00:24:30.400
in the room. And this was
all like an airport hanger size room that

311
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we're in, and I was on
the other side of the baffle, and

312
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you just felt it ripple through your
body. You just felt the sound just

313
00:24:37.920 --> 00:24:44.160
shake your whole body. And I
remember just going holy shit and not even

314
00:24:44.160 --> 00:24:49.319
thinking that microphones are running, so
at the very end of this awesome explosion,

315
00:24:49.400 --> 00:24:56.359
you just barely hear me go,
oh, we used the sound,

316
00:24:56.559 --> 00:24:59.359
We layered them and used them for
this explosion that we wanted them for.

317
00:24:59.480 --> 00:25:02.079
We did cut out my holy shit. Yeah, but I just remember just

318
00:25:02.119 --> 00:25:06.720
being like so frightened just because there
was like the one of these loud things

319
00:25:06.720 --> 00:25:10.160
I never thought would happen. Um
and boss, you're also sitting there like

320
00:25:10.720 --> 00:25:15.480
this thing was that big, and
actually overall it wasn't. It was the

321
00:25:15.880 --> 00:25:18.799
sound way that came from it that
was so big right there. We were

322
00:25:18.799 --> 00:25:22.240
in no danger from it than any
of the other ones. It was just

323
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that the sound the way the vacuum
imploded on that one was just wow massive.

324
00:25:27.440 --> 00:25:32.359
Um, So that that was an
interesting story as far as things that

325
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happened. I feel like that the
the holy shit would have been like an

326
00:25:37.799 --> 00:25:41.640
like an interesting thing to have left
in I can just I can hear like

327
00:25:41.319 --> 00:25:47.079
you know, um, Bruce willis
saying like holy shit, right, you

328
00:25:47.119 --> 00:25:49.759
know, like in like in a
one of the die Hard movies, you

329
00:25:49.799 --> 00:25:56.400
know, watching that happen and hearing
holy shit. But it probably wasn't fitting

330
00:25:56.440 --> 00:26:00.640
for them the thing you were doing
at the time. That also, he

331
00:26:00.680 --> 00:26:03.759
gets paid to talk. I get
paid to be quiet, right, right,

332
00:26:03.920 --> 00:26:07.440
right right, that's true. We
actually have to be careful when we're

333
00:26:07.440 --> 00:26:12.880
putting in background voices for TV shows
and films. So you have the background

334
00:26:12.920 --> 00:26:18.359
actors who are in the background and
they're mouthing words. They're actually not allowed

335
00:26:18.359 --> 00:26:22.799
to talk, or they're not supposed
to be speaking, they're mouthing words,

336
00:26:22.799 --> 00:26:26.599
so that you get the principal dialogue
clean, and when we go and fill

337
00:26:26.640 --> 00:26:32.160
in those background scenes like a bar
or something like that, we will put

338
00:26:32.240 --> 00:26:36.039
in what we call walla, which
is just sort of a murmur of voices

339
00:26:36.839 --> 00:26:40.839
but they're not saying anything in particular. And then we also have what's known

340
00:26:40.880 --> 00:26:45.400
as loop group, which is a
group of actors that are hired to recreate

341
00:26:45.440 --> 00:26:48.279
background voices, especially for a region. So you know, if it's a

342
00:26:48.319 --> 00:26:51.960
New York bar, you get a
bunch of actors that are doing New York

343
00:26:51.960 --> 00:26:56.119
accents. If it's a Southern bar, same sort of thing. But they

344
00:26:56.160 --> 00:27:00.759
have to be careful that they're portraying
somebody that's in the space, but not

345
00:27:00.960 --> 00:27:07.200
necessarily a particular person, because if
it is thought to be that actor,

346
00:27:08.160 --> 00:27:11.960
they could possibly i mean, the
actor should get paid more if they are

347
00:27:12.039 --> 00:27:17.319
talking on camera, And we have
to be careful that we don't cause it

348
00:27:17.359 --> 00:27:22.240
that people think that actor is the
one talking because of the fact that,

349
00:27:22.400 --> 00:27:25.319
you know, depending on the budget
of the project, it could be a

350
00:27:25.400 --> 00:27:27.960
problem if all of a sudden,
this actor who was getting paid whatever for

351
00:27:29.039 --> 00:27:32.240
being a non speaking role, all
of a sudden got bumped up to a

352
00:27:32.279 --> 00:27:37.680
speaking role. Wow, But Yeah, So there's those weird things that you

353
00:27:37.680 --> 00:27:42.759
have to consider. But I do
have one other story, not to do

354
00:27:42.799 --> 00:27:47.799
with sound effects for recording, but
have to do with mixing, which is

355
00:27:47.799 --> 00:27:52.759
the final part of our journey and
sound is we mix the sounds together,

356
00:27:52.880 --> 00:27:56.359
and that's sort of what everybody comes
to know as the sound of the film

357
00:27:56.480 --> 00:28:03.440
or TV show. And there's one
time when I was mixing a film and

358
00:28:03.920 --> 00:28:07.920
sitting there and I'd been mixing it
for about two weeks. It was a

359
00:28:07.960 --> 00:28:11.559
documentary, and it was a very
cool documentary. But sitting there with the

360
00:28:11.559 --> 00:28:15.880
producer and we were mixing it and
everybody's happy. And then the director and

361
00:28:15.960 --> 00:28:22.720
the director's wife and a friend of
the director came in and they came in

362
00:28:22.759 --> 00:28:26.960
to watch the film down for the
final playback for review and give me notes

363
00:28:27.000 --> 00:28:30.599
and everything. And we're like,
okay, cool, And so they come

364
00:28:30.599 --> 00:28:32.880
in. We're like, we're going
to watch the whole movie as a movie.

365
00:28:32.920 --> 00:28:36.400
You're going to lower the lights,
have your popcorn, have your coffee,

366
00:28:37.279 --> 00:28:38.359
you know, but watch it like
a movie and give me notes.

367
00:28:38.640 --> 00:28:44.000
They're like okay, So we lower
the lights, I hit play and the

368
00:28:44.079 --> 00:28:48.240
movie starts, and it starts off
with the sequence with cameras going off and

369
00:28:48.359 --> 00:28:52.160
people walking on the red carpet type
of scene we've all seen seeing these things,

370
00:28:52.680 --> 00:28:57.480
and all of a sudden, the
somebody jumps up in front of me

371
00:28:57.559 --> 00:29:00.160
because I'm sitting towards the back of
the room and they jump up in front

372
00:29:00.200 --> 00:29:03.039
of me, and I'm like,
I think they spelled their coffee or something

373
00:29:03.079 --> 00:29:07.039
happened, right, And so I
stopped the movie and I turn on the

374
00:29:07.079 --> 00:29:08.480
lights and I'm like, if everybody
okay, is everything okay? And they're

375
00:29:08.480 --> 00:29:11.279
like, yeah, yeah, yeah, but we thought you said this movie

376
00:29:11.319 --> 00:29:15.680
was insurround sound, and I'm like, it is in surround sound. They're

377
00:29:15.680 --> 00:29:18.000
like, but I don't hear it
in surround sound. I said, well,

378
00:29:18.039 --> 00:29:22.839
that's because this part of the film
doesn't have anything happening behind you.

379
00:29:23.440 --> 00:29:26.960
So that's why they're like, but
it's surrounds sound. And this comes to

380
00:29:27.000 --> 00:29:33.279
the fact that people get very lost
in the nomenclature of things and not necessarily

381
00:29:33.119 --> 00:29:40.400
what it means. So here we
are in this professional mixed studio with somebody

382
00:29:40.440 --> 00:29:42.039
and wasn't the director. It was
it was a friend. It was somebody

383
00:29:42.039 --> 00:29:47.680
who's not in the industry who just
was confused about what they were hearing.

384
00:29:48.160 --> 00:29:52.960
So then I took about ten to
fifteen minutes to explain to them how surround

385
00:29:52.000 --> 00:29:57.640
sound works. And I had to
mute the front speakers. And for the

386
00:29:57.720 --> 00:30:03.440
listeners who don't know, there's usually
at least three speakers up front by the

387
00:30:03.480 --> 00:30:06.200
screen, a left, center and
a right and then we have a left

388
00:30:06.240 --> 00:30:11.160
surround in a right surround. There's
many more nowadays, but that's the basics,

389
00:30:11.640 --> 00:30:15.640
and so yeah, I had a
mute the front speakers and play just

390
00:30:15.680 --> 00:30:19.000
a section where something was happening in
the back. And even so, when

391
00:30:19.039 --> 00:30:23.160
something happens in the back, we're
trying unless it's something like saving Private Ryan

392
00:30:23.400 --> 00:30:29.119
or The Fast and the Furious or
an Avengers movie, nothing should really be

393
00:30:29.160 --> 00:30:33.519
exciting in the back because you don't
want to distract from what's happening on the

394
00:30:33.559 --> 00:30:37.640
screen. And so yeah, it's
been about fifteen minutes, and the director

395
00:30:37.759 --> 00:30:41.079
was thankful that I did it,
But at the same time, I could

396
00:30:41.079 --> 00:30:42.839
only imagine going through their heads like, wow, I just paid for fifteen

397
00:30:42.880 --> 00:30:48.119
minutes of a educational lesson for my
friend to learn about sounds. But I

398
00:30:48.160 --> 00:30:52.279
didn't know this either, James,
Because we have surround sound and sometimes I

399
00:30:52.319 --> 00:30:56.559
don't hear anything from the back,
and I look at my husband and I

400
00:30:56.599 --> 00:30:59.519
go, Steve, I don't think
the surround sound is working. But you're

401
00:30:59.559 --> 00:31:03.960
telling that's how surround sound works.
You're not always going to hear it from

402
00:31:03.960 --> 00:31:07.519
all the speakers at the same time. Yeah, because I'm not always placing

403
00:31:07.519 --> 00:31:10.640
it in all the speakers at the
same time. You know, as part

404
00:31:10.640 --> 00:31:14.240
of my control as the sound and
part of the sound is onming, is

405
00:31:14.519 --> 00:31:18.640
what gets placed where on in the
speakers. Right, I have full control

406
00:31:18.720 --> 00:31:23.559
over whether or not a sound goes
across the screen or goes behind you or

407
00:31:23.640 --> 00:31:26.960
stays in front of you. In
the New Dolby, atmost we can do

408
00:31:27.079 --> 00:31:32.799
height speakers that go up into the
ceiling, and we control all of that.

409
00:31:32.880 --> 00:31:37.319
And that's part of the storytelling.
Right during an action sequence like the

410
00:31:37.319 --> 00:31:40.599
storming of the beach and saving Private
Ryan, they do a wonderful job.

411
00:31:40.640 --> 00:31:44.200
And I remember walking into the theater
during this scene and the bullets are whizzing

412
00:31:44.200 --> 00:31:47.039
past you, and those are going
into the surround speakers and going They're going

413
00:31:47.079 --> 00:31:49.119
from the front to the back and
the back to the front and side and

414
00:31:49.319 --> 00:31:52.799
every which way and everything like that, and Star Wars, Right, you

415
00:31:52.839 --> 00:31:59.559
have that opening shot where the pan
happens in the star destory or comes overhead,

416
00:31:59.640 --> 00:32:02.880
right, that goes from back to
front. That's when the surrounds are

417
00:32:02.880 --> 00:32:07.039
going to be used. And even
though in most times, like in The

418
00:32:07.119 --> 00:32:09.519
Patient, just because we know that's
a show that I recently worked on,

419
00:32:09.960 --> 00:32:15.279
you know, there is ambience in
all the speakers in that show to make

420
00:32:15.799 --> 00:32:22.440
the basement seem like a cave almost. You know, we put in basement

421
00:32:22.680 --> 00:32:28.440
in all the speakers, but it's
not very strong in the back speakers because

422
00:32:28.440 --> 00:32:30.759
we don't want you to turn your
head and be like, what's that noise

423
00:32:30.799 --> 00:32:35.240
happening behind me? Yeah, And
it's because it's not so strong when you're

424
00:32:35.240 --> 00:32:38.279
watching it in your own house,
it's not going to be fairly noticeable because

425
00:32:38.279 --> 00:32:42.279
your house makes a lot of noise
that's very similar to the noise that we're

426
00:32:42.319 --> 00:32:47.039
putting in for the basement, right. But in that also, if you

427
00:32:47.200 --> 00:32:54.279
remember an episode two of The Patient, there's one point where Steve Carrell's character,

428
00:32:54.759 --> 00:33:00.519
here's somebody upstairs, right, and
he looks upstairs, those sounds come

429
00:33:00.559 --> 00:33:05.640
out of all the speakers, just
try to simulate that they're overhead of you,

430
00:33:05.720 --> 00:33:07.920
because we did not mix this in
Dolby. At most, we didn't

431
00:33:07.920 --> 00:33:13.200
have ceiling speakers in mind for this
show. We did another phase correlation trick

432
00:33:13.279 --> 00:33:15.079
with it, where we put it
so that it sort of if you're sitting

433
00:33:15.160 --> 00:33:20.559
in the sweet spot, those footsteps, those house noises would sound like they're

434
00:33:20.559 --> 00:33:25.079
coming from in front of you,
So you know, that's when we're going

435
00:33:25.119 --> 00:33:29.480
to play with those things. But
to have something constantly going back there,

436
00:33:29.519 --> 00:33:32.279
that's going to be distracting. You
know, as soon as you take a

437
00:33:32.400 --> 00:33:37.279
viewer off of the screen, you've
pulled them out of the story. Yeah,

438
00:33:37.319 --> 00:33:40.880
and we don't ever want to pull
somebody out of the story. Just

439
00:33:42.039 --> 00:33:45.920
tell me what's been your favorite thing
to work on. I don't know if

440
00:33:45.920 --> 00:33:51.160
you feel comfortable saying that, either
your favorite show or your favorite episode of

441
00:33:51.200 --> 00:33:54.039
a show, or your favorite kind
of thing, like do you like the

442
00:33:54.680 --> 00:33:59.640
thing you know, like choo choo
choo going you know over you? I

443
00:33:59.680 --> 00:34:04.640
could never be a sound effects anything, but or do you like my jobs

444
00:34:04.920 --> 00:34:13.960
Jeopardy now? Yeah? I think
so. I mean, favorites are really

445
00:34:14.000 --> 00:34:19.559
hard to to pin down. I
am a person who likes uh different.

446
00:34:20.039 --> 00:34:22.239
I don't like to be pigeonholed.
I like to work on different types of

447
00:34:22.280 --> 00:34:29.400
things. I've worked on so many
great projects that really the ones that I

448
00:34:29.599 --> 00:34:34.760
would say are my favorite are the
ones that give me a challenge, and

449
00:34:34.880 --> 00:34:39.599
I feel like I've met the challenge
in One of one of my favorite scenes

450
00:34:39.679 --> 00:34:45.039
I do like to talk about is
from The Americans. In season three,

451
00:34:45.519 --> 00:34:51.559
there was a scene where there had
to be a tooth extraction. M Carrie

452
00:34:51.639 --> 00:34:54.880
Russell's character had broken a tooth and
being a Russian spy, can't just go

453
00:34:54.920 --> 00:35:00.880
to any dentist, right, um, So now her husband and quotes has

454
00:35:00.920 --> 00:35:07.679
to extract the tooth in their basement. And that scene, to me,

455
00:35:07.039 --> 00:35:13.760
was such a subtle sound design challenge
that we had to make it. It

456
00:35:13.800 --> 00:35:15.880
was a very It was shot very
intimately. It was actually shot like a

457
00:35:15.920 --> 00:35:21.280
love scene, very close up on
the eyes and reactions that way, and

458
00:35:21.800 --> 00:35:27.199
but yet we had to get the
nuances of pliers on a tooth trying to

459
00:35:27.199 --> 00:35:30.880
pull them out, and but yet
at the same time make it a very

460
00:35:30.920 --> 00:35:35.880
tender moment, you know, but
at the same time make it very disturbing.

461
00:35:35.960 --> 00:35:38.320
You know. My wife actually still
can't watch that scene because she's just

462
00:35:38.679 --> 00:35:40.480
like she's like, I'm going to
close my eyes and then she's like,

463
00:35:40.519 --> 00:35:45.000
I can't close my ears. This
is horrible. But that was probably one

464
00:35:45.159 --> 00:35:49.039
that one was one of my favorites
just because it was it was such a

465
00:35:49.119 --> 00:35:55.159
challenge to find this balance of disturbing
and intimate that made people realize that these

466
00:35:55.239 --> 00:36:01.280
characters do actually have a love for
each other and also for their job.

467
00:36:02.079 --> 00:36:06.679
That was one of my favorites.
I worked on a show for Tom Fontana

468
00:36:06.840 --> 00:36:14.000
called Borgia for Netflix with U and
that was that was fun and challenging ways

469
00:36:14.039 --> 00:36:17.440
because I've worked with Tom for a
number of years. For about almost my

470
00:36:17.480 --> 00:36:22.199
whole career twenty one years or so, I've been working with Tom on different

471
00:36:22.199 --> 00:36:28.760
shows, and he allows us to
explore the sonic possibilities of scenes, and

472
00:36:28.800 --> 00:36:34.719
he allows us to have a little
creative fun with how to show get the

473
00:36:34.719 --> 00:36:39.079
emotion out sonically. And so in
Borgia, there is one scene where we

474
00:36:39.119 --> 00:36:42.760
got to really just kind of go
crazy, which was a lot of fun.

475
00:36:43.960 --> 00:36:50.039
Rodrigo Borgia had sort of become addicted
to his medicine and it was causing

476
00:36:50.119 --> 00:36:54.639
him to hallucinate, and there's this
whole sequence of him hallucinating and pretty much

477
00:36:54.679 --> 00:37:01.480
everybody was like his family was popping
in and out of his vision and stuff,

478
00:37:01.480 --> 00:37:05.960
and you didn't really quite know what
was going on. And so I

479
00:37:06.079 --> 00:37:12.119
had the fun job of making what
I call the brain break sound, because

480
00:37:12.119 --> 00:37:15.199
they had these quick camera moves that
would sort of, you know, whip

481
00:37:15.239 --> 00:37:21.079
your head around right, and each
time that happened, something visually happened differently,

482
00:37:21.119 --> 00:37:24.280
like a different his son cesare would
show up or and so then we

483
00:37:24.639 --> 00:37:28.480
I got to come up with,
like, all right, what would happen

484
00:37:28.559 --> 00:37:30.880
sonically at this moment, right?
And you could just go for the normal

485
00:37:30.960 --> 00:37:35.239
whoosh for the camera, but I
wasn't doing the camera. I was doing

486
00:37:35.280 --> 00:37:37.920
what was happening in Rodrigo's brain.
So I had to come up with the

487
00:37:37.960 --> 00:37:40.719
sound of you know, brains are
electrical, and so it was sort of

488
00:37:40.760 --> 00:37:46.119
this sort of electrical discharge sound,
something breaking and stuff like that. So

489
00:37:46.159 --> 00:37:50.440
that was a lot of fun because
it's you know, fifteenth century Rome.

490
00:37:50.519 --> 00:37:53.239
You don't expect to hear these sort
of electrical sounds, but yet we made

491
00:37:53.280 --> 00:37:58.719
it work for this sequence. It
was a lot of fun, you know,

492
00:37:59.440 --> 00:38:01.920
every I like it when I work
on documentaries, and there was a

493
00:38:01.960 --> 00:38:07.199
documentary I worked on where the director
and I got along great. We just

494
00:38:07.079 --> 00:38:10.239
we sat there and we worked on
there on her film, and it was

495
00:38:10.320 --> 00:38:14.400
just so much. I don't want
to say fun, because when I tell

496
00:38:14.400 --> 00:38:17.400
you what the category of the documentary
was, you're gonna be like, that's

497
00:38:17.440 --> 00:38:22.639
not fun. But when you can
collaborate with somebody, it's just a rewarding

498
00:38:22.719 --> 00:38:28.639
experience. Sure, when you're working
on tough material like that, you kind

499
00:38:28.639 --> 00:38:30.719
of want to try to lighten the
mood a little bit, like on lunch

500
00:38:30.760 --> 00:38:36.039
breaks, you know, you just
kind of And so we were working and

501
00:38:36.159 --> 00:38:38.639
we took a lunch break and the
director and I were having a conversation.

502
00:38:38.760 --> 00:38:43.159
She was just like, oh,
so, you know, so similar to

503
00:38:43.199 --> 00:38:45.119
this. What's the craziest thing that
you've ever been asked to do for sound?

504
00:38:45.719 --> 00:38:50.119
And I said, well, my
nephews one time came to the studio

505
00:38:50.280 --> 00:38:53.800
when they were three, five,
and seven. They came to the studio

506
00:38:53.840 --> 00:38:57.280
to visit me, and I was
like, hey, guys, what do

507
00:38:57.320 --> 00:38:59.639
you want to hear? Because I
got every sound in the world. And

508
00:39:00.199 --> 00:39:02.320
you know, my one nephew is
a race car enthusiast, and he's like,

509
00:39:02.360 --> 00:39:04.880
I want to hear a race car. And I was like, all

510
00:39:05.000 --> 00:39:07.760
right, so type it into my
database and Brown got race cars everywhere.

511
00:39:08.239 --> 00:39:12.039
Next nephew is like, I want
to hear a t rex because nobody could

512
00:39:12.079 --> 00:39:15.639
record one of those, And of
course I type in t rex and so

513
00:39:15.639 --> 00:39:20.039
many people have made made t rex
sounds. There's t rex is going on

514
00:39:20.079 --> 00:39:24.360
and I don't know. And then
my youngest nephew just goes sloth and I'm

515
00:39:24.400 --> 00:39:30.480
like sloth, Like yeah, sloth, and I'm like, I didn't have

516
00:39:30.480 --> 00:39:32.599
a sloth sound anywhere, like,
oh my god. And they do make

517
00:39:32.639 --> 00:39:36.239
sounds but I didn't happen to have
any at that time. And I was

518
00:39:36.280 --> 00:39:37.480
like, oh. So I was
telling this director the story and she was

519
00:39:37.519 --> 00:39:40.119
just like, oh my goodness,
that's so funny. By the way,

520
00:39:40.159 --> 00:39:45.280
I want the sound of a t
Rex in my film somehow. And I'm

521
00:39:45.320 --> 00:39:50.079
like what She's like, She's like, I want you to put a t

522
00:39:50.280 --> 00:39:53.599
Rex in my film. And I'm
like, okay, well, challenge accepted.

523
00:39:53.760 --> 00:39:57.119
I will somehow find a way to
make a t Rex work in this

524
00:39:57.159 --> 00:40:04.000
film. And so there this one
shot where we're following, you know,

525
00:40:04.119 --> 00:40:08.599
some guerrilla warriors going through the jungle
sort of thing. It was a recreation

526
00:40:08.719 --> 00:40:15.360
that she had done to show these
soldiers marking through, marching through, and

527
00:40:15.519 --> 00:40:21.000
it just had this sort of Slytherin
type camera feel to it. And so

528
00:40:21.039 --> 00:40:24.559
I found one of my t Rex
sounds that was this low, rumbly growl,

529
00:40:25.199 --> 00:40:29.360
and I put it in and it
just sort of followed the movement of

530
00:40:29.400 --> 00:40:32.599
the camera behind these soldiers and it
just added this menacing feel to it,

531
00:40:32.679 --> 00:40:37.119
which was so perfect. I mean, it really did fit. But you're

532
00:40:37.159 --> 00:40:40.880
sitting there like, wow, I
just put a t Rex sound in a

533
00:40:40.960 --> 00:40:49.519
documentary. But the director actually tells
that story at every screening because she's just

534
00:40:49.599 --> 00:40:52.480
trying to lighten the mood too.
Yeah, you know, she realizes this

535
00:40:52.559 --> 00:40:55.760
is a heavy subject matter and we're
not trying to make light of it.

536
00:40:55.880 --> 00:41:01.119
But in order to keep people engaged, you have to bring them back out

537
00:41:01.159 --> 00:41:04.800
of it, as I'm sure you
know. Of course. You know,

538
00:41:04.840 --> 00:41:07.559
I've done documentaries where it's like I've
worked on documentaries for six months in a

539
00:41:07.639 --> 00:41:14.119
row. There's one time and I
was I never get the happy documentaries.

540
00:41:15.119 --> 00:41:20.079
I almost always get the you know, really tough material ones. My wife

541
00:41:20.119 --> 00:41:22.280
was like, oh my god,
you are so depressed, Like because all

542
00:41:22.320 --> 00:41:28.679
I've been doing for the last yeah, six months is hearing the horrors that

543
00:41:28.719 --> 00:41:34.960
are out there. Yeah, So
you know, just feel free to call

544
00:41:35.039 --> 00:41:37.760
me next time. You know,
it's okay, I'll talk it out with

545
00:41:37.880 --> 00:41:44.480
you, or I can like come
visit the sets or you know. I've

546
00:41:44.480 --> 00:41:47.679
been fairly lucky recently that all the
stuff I've been called upon when it is

547
00:41:47.679 --> 00:41:52.079
a doc, it's not super long
and depressing. It's usually I get called

548
00:41:52.119 --> 00:41:57.039
on for like a week or two. But this was early on in my

549
00:41:57.079 --> 00:42:00.159
career, and really I didn't say
no to anything. Then we have other

550
00:42:00.159 --> 00:42:02.480
things where we take t rex sounds
and put them. I had a one

551
00:42:02.519 --> 00:42:07.440
film, here's a good one for
you that it was a fiction piece.

552
00:42:07.519 --> 00:42:15.199
It was a narrative piece that you
know, had the story revolved around homeless

553
00:42:15.199 --> 00:42:20.639
shelters, and it was you followed
one character as he bounced in and out

554
00:42:20.679 --> 00:42:24.760
of homeless shelters. And it was
actually a very nice piece of very redeeming

555
00:42:24.800 --> 00:42:30.400
piece, very sort of different than
your Hollywood piece, which was kind of

556
00:42:30.480 --> 00:42:32.920
nice. There was no soundtrack score
with it. In fact, the only

557
00:42:32.960 --> 00:42:37.440
time score came in was at in
like the last five minutes of the film.

558
00:42:37.639 --> 00:42:40.360
Throughout the rest of the film there
was music but it was all diegetic

559
00:42:40.440 --> 00:42:44.760
music. It was like, you
know, somebody's radio coming from their apartment,

560
00:42:45.119 --> 00:42:47.559
or you know, a car driving
by playing a song sort of thing.

561
00:42:49.199 --> 00:42:52.599
So sound really played a big part
in this. In fact, there

562
00:42:52.639 --> 00:42:54.800
wasn't as much dialogue in the film
because you just sort of followed this man

563
00:42:54.840 --> 00:43:00.039
along, and so we had to
build this soundscape of New York. It

564
00:43:00.159 --> 00:43:04.079
was really a great challenge, a
lot of fun to do. And the

565
00:43:04.119 --> 00:43:07.760
director was like, I want it
to be an assault. I want you

566
00:43:07.800 --> 00:43:10.920
know that we're in this guy who's
homeless in New York and it's just an

567
00:43:10.920 --> 00:43:14.599
assault of a city, right,
And it's like, okay, So we

568
00:43:15.159 --> 00:43:16.960
built this soundscape up and then the
direction said, and I also have one

569
00:43:16.960 --> 00:43:22.679
more challenge for you. I want
to hear every bodily function happened at some

570
00:43:22.719 --> 00:43:30.519
point during this film. And I'm
like what He's like, I want a

571
00:43:30.760 --> 00:43:35.559
fart, I want pee, I
want oop, I want burp, I

572
00:43:35.599 --> 00:43:38.480
want sneeze, I want cough,
I want yawn, I want everything.

573
00:43:38.519 --> 00:43:44.239
I want all to happen is and
the star of the film, the main

574
00:43:44.320 --> 00:43:45.559
character, also happened to be a
producer, and he's like, just don't

575
00:43:45.599 --> 00:43:49.639
make it sound like I'm doing all
those things. I was like, okay,

576
00:43:49.679 --> 00:43:52.320
we will keep it from you.
But the challenge was was to make

577
00:43:52.320 --> 00:43:57.559
sure that every bodily function, at
some point or another me And it wasn't

578
00:43:57.559 --> 00:44:00.159
something that you're like, oh,
there's the fart. It was just like

579
00:44:00.519 --> 00:44:02.039
sneak it in there, right it
was. It was kind of like we

580
00:44:02.079 --> 00:44:06.440
always do these, you know,
filmmakers always have these little easter eggs,

581
00:44:06.599 --> 00:44:09.280
right. Um. We can't do
them for ourselves, you know, we

582
00:44:09.480 --> 00:44:15.440
we we you know, the folks
from Skywalker are known for the Wilhelm scream,

583
00:44:15.880 --> 00:44:22.119
which is this scream that Ben Burt
had discovered from an old western and

584
00:44:22.199 --> 00:44:27.159
it has been used in like every
Star Wars film since of this ridiculous other

585
00:44:27.199 --> 00:44:30.679
top type thing, right um.
And that's sort of like now the general

586
00:44:30.719 --> 00:44:36.119
public knows about it, so everybody's
looking for the Wilhelm scream, but internally

587
00:44:36.159 --> 00:44:39.000
we all sort of put in these
little things to ourselves that you know,

588
00:44:39.159 --> 00:44:44.000
it's it's like, oh, that's
my dog barking in the background, did

589
00:44:44.039 --> 00:44:45.920
you hear my you know, like
that sort of thing. So for this

590
00:44:45.960 --> 00:44:52.960
film, it was a bodily function. I mean, that's so idiosyncratic,

591
00:44:52.239 --> 00:44:58.039
but I love it, just like, you know, just like the dinosaur

592
00:44:58.639 --> 00:45:01.800
Like, it wasn't like here's a
dinosaur, it was just use this sound

593
00:45:01.880 --> 00:45:07.159
somewhere in the film to add to
the mood or something like that. So

594
00:45:07.119 --> 00:45:13.000
yeah, yeah, that's fascinating.
And that's part of what I really have

595
00:45:13.079 --> 00:45:17.039
to do and think about whenever I'm
working on something, right, is you

596
00:45:17.079 --> 00:45:22.519
know, do I always need to
use the same thing to make the sound

597
00:45:22.519 --> 00:45:24.880
that you're hearing? No, I
need to make the feeling with sound,

598
00:45:25.400 --> 00:45:30.559
right, So who's the feeling that
is meant to be conveyed? So who

599
00:45:30.639 --> 00:45:35.840
got paid to poop and record it? That's how do you get a job

600
00:45:35.920 --> 00:45:40.880
like that? Oh well, that's
the thing. It's not actually poop that

601
00:45:44.440 --> 00:45:47.559
you know. There are many ways
to make it sound like what you need,

602
00:45:49.039 --> 00:45:51.760
right, just just like the urinating
sound. You know, I could

603
00:45:51.800 --> 00:45:54.079
take a picture and pour it slowly
into a toilet and make it sound just

604
00:45:54.119 --> 00:45:59.239
like somebody's peeing. Oh yeah,
the same sort of thing with with poop.

605
00:45:59.360 --> 00:46:01.320
We actually I used a very similar
sound in one of the episodes of

606
00:46:01.320 --> 00:46:07.199
The Americans in the first season.
Also, okay, all right, on

607
00:46:07.360 --> 00:46:13.960
that note, it's always on the
poop note. Yeah, it's always always

608
00:46:13.960 --> 00:46:20.039
going to end with pooh. James, thank you so much for coming on.

609
00:46:20.199 --> 00:46:24.079
I really appreciate it. I loved
I mean, I really appreciated like

610
00:46:24.320 --> 00:46:30.840
learning more. And I'm sure obviously
there's countless more things I don't know,

611
00:46:31.000 --> 00:46:37.440
but I really enjoyed hearing kind of
the things that went wrong or just the

612
00:46:37.039 --> 00:46:42.760
really interesting things you get asked to
do as the sound designer, you know,

613
00:46:42.960 --> 00:46:45.719
like add a t rex or something. So that was really great.

614
00:46:47.039 --> 00:46:51.719
Thanks. It was my fason beyond
here. It's fun sort of talking about

615
00:46:51.760 --> 00:46:53.519
the story. Normally when I get
interviewed, it's always you know, how

616
00:46:53.559 --> 00:46:57.800
did you make this sound? So
it's kind of nice to be able to

617
00:46:57.840 --> 00:47:00.280
tell the wackier stories. Yeah,
yeah, yeah, that's what this show's

618
00:47:00.320 --> 00:47:06.320
all about, all the everyone's wacky
story. So well, thank you so

619
00:47:06.400 --> 00:47:12.639
much, and good luck with Alaska
Daily and I will look forward to watching

620
00:47:12.679 --> 00:47:20.599
that in February, and good luck
on future projects. And thank you.

621
00:47:21.159 --> 00:47:23.239
Yeah, it was a pleasure.
Thank you so much. Same here.

622
00:47:23.320 --> 00:47:31.400
Thank you. So that was James
David Reading, the third sound designer and

623
00:47:31.599 --> 00:47:37.239
sound effects editor for shows like The
Americans and The Queen's Gambit and The Patient.

624
00:47:39.519 --> 00:47:45.599
That was so interesting, and normally
at this moment in my show,

625
00:47:45.239 --> 00:47:50.920
Tyler would come on and we would
talk about what just happened on the interview

626
00:47:51.480 --> 00:47:57.440
today. And from now on,
I have Maggie Bowls, who was already

627
00:47:57.480 --> 00:48:00.039
on an episode of this Ship that
Happens to Me podcast. I think it

628
00:48:00.079 --> 00:48:06.559
was episode seventy four, being in
Paris. Maggie is now the producer of

629
00:48:06.599 --> 00:48:09.800
my show. Welcome Maggie, how
are you? Hello? Thank you.

630
00:48:10.000 --> 00:48:16.239
I'm doing great. So let's talk
about that episode with James. What did

631
00:48:16.239 --> 00:48:20.800
you think about that? I was
thought that was like I learned so much.

632
00:48:20.880 --> 00:48:23.559
I still don't know what I don't
know, right, Yeah, yeah,

633
00:48:23.639 --> 00:48:30.400
I I never really I don't really
spend a lot of time thinking about

634
00:48:30.440 --> 00:48:34.639
all of that sound design that goes
into TV and movies. But there was

635
00:48:34.679 --> 00:48:38.440
the one he talked about with the
Americans, the scene where they have to

636
00:48:38.440 --> 00:48:44.199
pull the tooth in the Americans,
and I remember watching that scene and how

637
00:48:44.880 --> 00:48:51.159
intense and kind of gross, but
but personal, I don't know I was

638
00:48:51.880 --> 00:48:54.800
that scene thinking about all of the
pieces that went into making that scene feel

639
00:48:54.880 --> 00:48:59.199
less intense as it was. That
was very cool to me. Yeah,

640
00:48:59.239 --> 00:49:02.000
And I think you just don't think
about I mean, I think after you've

641
00:49:02.559 --> 00:49:07.280
listened to this podcast, you're going
to think about it a lot. How

642
00:49:07.119 --> 00:49:10.960
so much sound is added after the
fact. Like think about when you watch

643
00:49:12.039 --> 00:49:15.159
like two characters. You watch a
character on screen in a phone call,

644
00:49:15.599 --> 00:49:19.960
and you can hear the person on
the other end talking. I mean,

645
00:49:19.960 --> 00:49:23.280
that's a really obvious one, but
it's just the seamless part of the show

646
00:49:23.400 --> 00:49:27.360
that you're watching. You just take
it for granted that you can hear what

647
00:49:27.400 --> 00:49:30.840
the other person is saying, but
clearly they've had to add that sound,

648
00:49:30.119 --> 00:49:35.920
right, Yeah, but you also
you might hear a door slam down the

649
00:49:35.920 --> 00:49:40.199
hall boom that's added afterwards. You
might hear someone pull up outside on the

650
00:49:40.239 --> 00:49:46.519
gravel. That sound is added afterwards. Like every single sound is added,

651
00:49:46.679 --> 00:49:51.840
and you just don't even And that's
his job is to make you not even

652
00:49:52.079 --> 00:49:54.559
think about the fact that it's added. Yeah, well, all those little

653
00:49:54.599 --> 00:49:59.199
things, like just like being alive
in the world everywhere you are, all

654
00:49:59.199 --> 00:50:01.519
the little noises that are happening at
all times. That makes something feel real.

655
00:50:02.039 --> 00:50:06.880
You know that all has to be
very intentionally placed, and the like

656
00:50:06.920 --> 00:50:08.719
the levels and where it is.
If it's around sound like you know,

657
00:50:08.719 --> 00:50:13.599
if it's coming from behind you or
the side, or you know, or

658
00:50:13.639 --> 00:50:17.199
like he was talking about the in
the patient when it's upstairs. You know,

659
00:50:17.280 --> 00:50:21.880
how they made that happen, how
they make it feel like it's like

660
00:50:21.920 --> 00:50:25.239
the sound is coming from upstairs.
I think that's that's pretty cool. And

661
00:50:25.239 --> 00:50:30.239
that he's thinking about where a sound, what speaker you're going to hear that

662
00:50:30.400 --> 00:50:35.559
sound from, Like I didn't know
that that he's the one making that sound

663
00:50:35.599 --> 00:50:37.679
come from the back speaker, or
from the back to the front, from

664
00:50:37.760 --> 00:50:40.760
the front to the back, from
the left to the right, the right

665
00:50:40.800 --> 00:50:46.039
to the left. It's obviously it
sounds so technical. I had no idea

666
00:50:46.119 --> 00:50:51.599
that it was something involved. Yeah, what was your favorite part about that?

667
00:50:51.840 --> 00:50:57.360
I mean I think that the the
the tooth pulling thing was really yeah,

668
00:50:57.440 --> 00:50:59.679
right, that that stay. I
mean I already mentioned it, but

669
00:50:59.719 --> 00:51:02.400
that really stood out to me as
because I was like transported back into that

670
00:51:02.480 --> 00:51:07.679
scene, you know, And I
was thinking about he said his wife,

671
00:51:07.679 --> 00:51:10.199
like his wife like closes her eyes, but when she sees it, when

672
00:51:10.239 --> 00:51:13.360
she sees the scene, but she
can still hear it, you know,

673
00:51:13.760 --> 00:51:15.440
And like I think about that all
the time because I hate Gore. I

674
00:51:15.519 --> 00:51:19.960
hate gore in movies, and so
I'll always cover my own eyes if something

675
00:51:20.599 --> 00:51:23.400
scary is happening. But it doesn't
matter if like the noises, the squorshing,

676
00:51:24.039 --> 00:51:28.199
you know, or like the smashing, you know, all of that

677
00:51:28.280 --> 00:51:32.880
stuff. Like the sound contributes so
much to the creepiness of so many things.

678
00:51:34.119 --> 00:51:38.880
So it's it's why I won't watch
a zombie movie because you can cover

679
00:51:38.960 --> 00:51:44.960
your eyes, but you can still
hear them. And I hate the sound

680
00:51:45.000 --> 00:51:51.480
of zombies. I agree. I
also hate the sound of songs. I

681
00:51:51.519 --> 00:51:57.360
loved the story about about that one
director who wanted every bodily function in his

682
00:51:57.440 --> 00:52:01.440
film. That yeah, yeah,
that was so strange. What an odd

683
00:52:01.440 --> 00:52:06.800
request, I know, and that
that's like his little Easter egg. Maybe

684
00:52:06.840 --> 00:52:08.719
he does that in every film.
You know, he didn't want to tell

685
00:52:08.800 --> 00:52:13.840
us who it was, but maybe
he does that in every film he makes.

686
00:52:13.960 --> 00:52:20.079
That would be really bizarre. Go
crosscheck IMDb with directors and yes,

687
00:52:20.480 --> 00:52:23.079
we can figure out who it is. Yeah, let's do that. I'll

688
00:52:23.119 --> 00:52:27.760
literally do that, like we're gonna
say goodbye, and I'm literally gonna go

689
00:52:27.800 --> 00:52:31.320
on and do that. I'll let
you know if I learn anything. Great.

690
00:52:31.480 --> 00:52:39.400
All right, Well, thanks everyone, Thank you Maggie for producing my

691
00:52:39.519 --> 00:52:45.320
show. Now and stay tuned for
more really great and exciting guests, and

692
00:52:45.960 --> 00:52:52.519
don't forget to subscribe, rate,
review the podcast, share with your friends,

693
00:52:52.639 --> 00:52:55.280
tell everyone you know, and we'll
be back in a couple of weeks

694
00:52:55.280 --> 00:53:00.679
for another episode of the Ship that
Happens to Me. Bye bye, Thanks

695
00:53:00.719 --> 00:53:05.199
for listening to my ship. I
really appreciate it. Come back and hear

696
00:53:05.280 --> 00:53:07.159
more shit next time on the Ship
that Happens to Me podcast. Do you

697
00:53:07.199 --> 00:53:12.920
think I've said shit enough for one
podcast episode? Tune in next time to

698
00:53:13.039 --> 00:53:23.519
the Ship that Happens to Me podcasts. You gotta, baby,