July 10, 2025
Why Gen Z's Struggle Isn't Just About Social Media
Send us a text Trigger Warning: Suicide and SA was discussed. What if everything we think we know about the Gen Z mental health crisis is incomplete? In this eye-opening conversation, suicide survivor, author, and mental health advocate Aly Vredenberg challenges conventional wisdom by revealing four interconnected factors driving declining mental health among young people: economics, isolation, environment, and meaning. Aly shares her deeply personal journey, beginning with a suicide attempt...
Trigger Warning: Suicide and SA was discussed.
What if everything we think we know about the Gen Z mental health crisis is incomplete? In this eye-opening conversation, suicide survivor, author, and mental health advocate Aly Vredenberg challenges conventional wisdom by revealing four interconnected factors driving declining mental health among young people: economics, isolation, environment, and meaning.
Aly shares her deeply personal journey, beginning with a suicide attempt at age 14 following sexual assault and severe bullying. After surviving this darkest moment, she dedicated herself to understanding mental health, only to face profound grief when her best friend died by suicide in 2020. Rather than retreating into her pain, Aly channeled it into researching the complex roots of our mental health epidemic, culminating in her book "Out of Focus."
Unlike many discussions that point to social media as the primary culprit, Aly presents compelling evidence that the crisis began in 2007 - before Instagram, TikTok, or Snapchat existed. She reveals startling statistics about Gen Z's economic disadvantages, the physiological impact of decreased access to nature, and how modern city design has systematically eliminated opportunities for human connection. The conversation dives deep into how these structural factors create conditions where meaninglessness and isolation flourish.
Most powerfully, Aly introduces prevention-based solutions that address root causes rather than symptoms. From universal healthcare with mental health parity to trauma-informed schools and national service programs, she outlines practical approaches that could transform mental wellbeing at a societal level. We also learn about her forthcoming nonprofit "The Belonging Lab" where people who struggle with mental health can come together and feel supported.
More information about Aly can be found at:
www.belonginglabsd.org
www.outoffocusbookcom
Instagram: @alyvredenburg
00:00 - Introducing Allie and Her Book
10:13 - Allie's Personal Journey With Suicide
17:51 - Four Factors Behind Gen Z's Mental Health Crisis
29:14 - Loneliness and Social Media's Role
41:42 - Environment and Mental Health Connection
53:02 - Solutions and The Belonging Lab Launch
01:00:42 - Final Thoughts on Kindness and Connection
WEBVTT
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Hello everyone and welcome to this week's episode of On the Spectrum with Sonia, a podcast where we discuss autism spectrum mental health and highlight inspirational stories to leave our audience feeling connected, encouraged, loved, supported, especially in a world where people are made to feel disconnected on a daily.
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People are made to feel disconnected on a daily.
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Today we have a very special guest, allie Vredenberg.
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She is out of California and she has a bachelor's degree in sociology and a master's in social innovation from the University of San Diego.
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She has written a book called Out of Focus, where she talks about Gen Z's mental health from a perspective that differs from what people customarily think about mental health, and to discuss her book and to discuss those pillars of what she's found in Gen Z mental health is Allie.
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Allie, thank you so much for being here today.
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I'm so happy to be here.
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Thank you.
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So, allie, why don't you tell us a little bit about you, your background?
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Yeah, yeah, I'm happy to speak on me.
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I am, first of all, a Gen Z.
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I'm a member of Gen Z and I recently published my book out of focus why Gen Z's mental health crisis is more complex than you think and I actually am launching my non-profit called the Lab.
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We have our launch party this month and I'm super excited about it.
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We have a 5K in August called the Stay 5K, and I'm basically I've dedicated my life to trying to solve this mental health crisis in young people.
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I personally am a suicide survivor.
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When I was 14, I tried to take my life and, by some miracle, my mom found me and took me to the hospital and I survived.
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I was given another chance and that gave me a huge, huge insight into the ways our systems are failing young people.
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I am really lucky in that I've overcome pretty much all of the things I was struggling with.
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But in 2020, my best friend died from suicide and that pretty much changed the trajectory of my life.
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I spent pretty much a year in bed like, unable to move.
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I was just so crippled with grief.
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It was probably the hardest time I've ever been through, truly, and she was like so many other people where she struggled in silence and people didn't know how bad it was, until she was gone and I was just starting my master's program in social innovation when she passed and I had gone into my master's wanting to create a social enterprise to help the mental health crisis.
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I've been passionate about mental health since I was a little girl, I think because I had struggled for so long, but really what ended up happening was I spent years getting my master's just trying to educate myself and why there's a mental health crisis after her passing, and so that's what led me to write my book, and now, finally, I'm using my master's degree to start my social enterprise.
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Well, Allie, thank you for sharing your story with us.
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I know that must have been a very difficult thing, you know, not only to have undergone, but then also to be able to be to share as well that vulnerability.
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It seemed like when you were 14, you were in a very dark place and, if you don't mind sharing with us what was going on at that time that drove you to that place very, very dark place.
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I was sexually assaulted and the boy that did it decided he wanted to just absolutely bully the heck out of me.
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I couldn't walk down the halls of the school without being coughed at, laughed at, made fun of, being told I was a whore.
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I mean, it was just awful.
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And I went home every day and I told my parents I need to leave the school.
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The school's awful.
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They paid, you know, 20 grand a year for me to be at that school.
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It's supposed to be the top school in, you know, the whole country.
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I mean, it was a really big, great private school apparently.
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But I was just tormented and finally it came to a point where I just felt like I don't belong here, I shouldn't be here anymore.
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I'm, I don't have value.
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I just felt so alone, so alone, and I didn't feel like I was heard or seen, and so I felt like I had no way out, which obviously wasn't true at all.
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And sitting here today, I couldn't be more grateful that I'm here.
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Truly, I'm so grateful to be here and so grateful that my mom found me, because I really do believe there is so much hope.
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There is so much hope and it's like pretty much anyone you speak to who's a suicide survivor will say the same thing and that they're grateful they're here and that they're grateful it didn't work.
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So I can say that really honestly and you're sharing your story and you're sharing ways to help with the mental health crisis for the younger generation, because your voice is so valuable and you're so needed and I'm grateful that you never took your life.
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Thank you.
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Allie, so you see your best friend.
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I know she unfortunately in 2020 ended her life, did you?
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know what was going on.
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At that time I did know she was struggling and I actually made a song.
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It's kind of funny.
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I love music, I'm very artistic.
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Creativity is one of the most actually important ways to heal when struggling with mental health issues, i't you know, and I wish you were here and so, like I in the friendship, really wanted to sort of save her because I knew she was struggling and unfortunately she lived very far from me.
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She lived about three hours away.
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And so.
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I just I couldn't save her and it really hurt, and of course it wasn't my job to save her.
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And looking back at it now I see that really the system she went to to get help did not help her or give her the help she truly needed, and so that also fueled a lot of my anger towards the system.
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You know.
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It's really interesting that you talk about the systems failing her, because I've been to therapists who are nothing short of being a bully, right, and a lot of times therapists and people don't say this enough and as someone who'd been bullied by professionals who should have been helping me but made me feel like a less than and made me feel worse, right, I can just say that you know it's so easy when you're on that other side that you know it's like.
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You know it's like.
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Are they speaking like for everyone?
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And are they, you know, am I being targeted Because?
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Are they speaking what everybody in the world feels about me now?
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And am I really this horrible person, person?
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And I look at people who were strong and stood up for themselves and made a difference and I feel like you know what this?
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It's so easy, especially those with PhDs.
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Okay, you see this a lot.
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I'm not judging the whole profession, but you see a lot of them abuse their power and use their doctorate.
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And abuse their power because they know they can get away with it, because of the status, because they can call themselves a doctor, because of the kind of prestige that people will place on their title, that people will place on their title.
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Yeah, I'm really feeling.
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I'm feeling what you're feeling right now.
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It's so so many therapists.
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I think there was this woman who I interviewed who was a therapist and I'm not sure if this is a completely accurate statistic, but she was saying about 20 percent of therapists account for 80 percent of the positive outcomes which in other words is sort of meaning like there's 20 percent of therapists are amazing and they help so many people and then the other 80 percent are doing harm.
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And that's something that not enough of people are really talking about, I think, because in the profession, a lot of people in these spaces really want to encourage people to get care, because good care does really help people.
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But the problem is is that so many of these professionals are not actually continuing their training.
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They're not really.
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A lot of them are burned out, which I'm sure you've heard of the term empathy fatigue, but I think a lot of them are jaded.
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They have empathy fatigue.
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They're speaking to people all day long and thinking, oh, these people are just, they're playing the victim.
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Oh, these people are just they're playing the victim.
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You know, they have this mindset coming in where they're not truly having empathy or awareness over how much of an impact they have on people.
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And unfortunately, because there is such a shortage of workers because obviously, as the numbers keep going up, we're going to need more and more workers it's unfortunate because I think a lot of people are going in and being quickly pushed through and not given the training and the tools they need to be really good therapists as well, yeah absolutely.
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And even for the training I could say thankfully, absolutely.
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And you know, even like for the training, I could say like thankfully, I have the financial means to pay for the continuing ed, but those are not cheap by any means.
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Like, I will look at like prices for even in-person conferences, online stuff, and they really do make you pinch your wallet, you know, and it is hard and I understand about, like, the empathy and the burnout, you know, because it is hard, because you try your best, you know, you do your best, you do what you can and I feel like, a lot of times too, you know, it's like a double-edged sword because, on one hand, there are people who are truly trying to help and truly trying to make a difference, but, on the other hand, they can only do so much because they can't help everybody either.
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Right, like nobody can help everybody, let's just put it this way.
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Right, if we think about the set large, like, for example, a cardiologist is not going to be able to help somebody who has an appendix rupture and has appendicitis, because that's not their specialty, right?
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You think about, like you know, there's just people that you know, you, you try your best and you do your best and all you want.
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You know you'd put your good faith effort in and now I?
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I absolutely love to learn.
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I'm a nerd, so I enjoy going to listen to Pessy and going to these conferences, even online, to like learn more.
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But yes, it is.
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It is hard, it is.
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It's not an easy job.
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For sure.
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It's not for the faint of heart either, for sure what sucks, too, is that, like teachers, therapists are kind of expected to do it for the good of the world, and they're not necessarily paid enough, and so a lot of therapists aren't having like.
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To have good mental health, you need to meet your most basic needs.
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That's housing, safety, clean water, clean air, friendships, community, etc.
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And even therapists the people who are trying to have help people have good mental health.
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I think a lot of them probably struggle as well because they're not having their basic needs met if they're being, you know, underpaid and struggling to pay for student debt and the likes of it.
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So it's hard.
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It's like the people who are on the front lines of this crisis are also really burned out and struggling themselves.
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A lot of them.
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Yes, and a lot of times too, it depends on, like, where people are working, because I feel like a lot of times are working, because I feel like a lot of times, um, the you know, depending on the structure of the practice, it's very much run like how friends would describe working in a law firm, right, where you have to bill a certain amount of hours, you have to work a certain amount of hours.
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Um, I had, you know, there was a couple of places where I've worked where it was customary, right, that you had to hit certain benchmarks each week and if you didn't, you'd know about it, right, if you didn't, you you know, there'd be a discussion about it.
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They and a lot of it is going to your point.
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Yes, you know, people need to be paid for their work, because people need also to pay their bills, keep up with the cost of living and things like that.
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But absolutely it's a very poignant point you bring out that people don't talk about enough.
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Truly, but I think that is one small thing I write about in my book, but I will say I believe there are four main things causing the crisis, and I'd love to go into them.
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Sure, I believe they're economics, isolation, environment and meaning.
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Economics, isolation, environment and meaning.
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And what's unique about gen z is that we grew up during one of the worst recessions since the great depression, and so at the height of the great recession, which was around 2011 to 2012, that was when most gen Zers were still children and nearly one in four of us lived in poverty, and so that's higher than any other rates of other generations like millennials, gen X, boomers at similar ages to us at that time.
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And what's crazy is, if you look just a year later, in 2012, almost 30 million Gen Zers so that's nearly half of our generation were living in low income households, and so that means that millions of young people basically stepped into adulthood carrying childhood trauma, financial instability and, just honestly, a deep uncertainty about our futures deep uncertainty about our futures, and so a lot of us have struggled economically and that's been a huge hit on our generation that a lot of people don't think about or consider, and obviously I'm sure you know the data when people are growing up in poverty.
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They've done studies where, if you grow up in poverty, there's like, let me think about what the data was.
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I think it was 1.5 to three times more likely to experience depression or anxiety.
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Sure, these are high numbers.
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So in my book I talk about how one of the biggest things we can do to help this mental health crisis is help our economy, help people who are struggling in poverty.
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Like that's one big way we can truly help people is getting people housing, getting people, you know, safe water, food, cleaning our air, etc.
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And so getting these basic needs is kind of the first step to helping the mental health crisis that I think a lot of people don't think about.
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And obviously in these circles we're always told go to therapy, take medication that's going to cure you, but it doesn't really think about the underlying root problems that a lot of people struggle with when they end up struggling with depression and anxiety, which are kind of the main things I talk about in my book.
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Right, right, and definitely having those.
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It goes back into kind of like that Maslow's hierarchy of needs.
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Right, when the height where the highest level is self-actualization.
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But before you can even get to self-actualization you have to have your basic needs met first, right?
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So that's food, shelter, clothing, safety, right, your basic levels need to be met first before you can progress up to reach your highest level of self.
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Exactly, and I love Maslow's hierarchy of needs.
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That theory is just so, so relevant, especially today, and I think that's one thing that Gen Z just it makes us so anxious and depressed because our parents are doing better than us and will do better than us.
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We can't afford housing.
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I mean, housing has gone up an insane amount, but the wages have not.
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The cost of college has gone up, I think about 400%.
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So when our parents could go off and go and get their degree, they weren't paying off $100,000 worth of student loans, whereas we have crazy amounts of student loans.
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Our parents were able to buy a house for fifty thousand dollars in 1970 and now, you know, an average house, at least here in san diego, is a million dollars.
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So we would have to make over a hundred dollars an hour to be able to afford the house our parents were able to afford, you know, for way less, and so that alone is really really, really stressful.
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But then also the cost of healthcare has gone up, I think 200, 300%, and so when you combine all of these things and look at the way Gen Z is living economically, we are just not in a good place.
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But the thing that's complicated is, if you look at all the different factors, economics is obviously just one of many things that's happening for Gen.
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Z.
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Yes, and you know I definitely hear this from my clients because I do have clients going off to college this fall and they did talk about the costs and you know that was some of the that was the major deciding factor of where they were going to go to school is because of what, what the costs are going to be, of what what the costs are going to be and um, so I mean it and that has been a concern.
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I know, like that was a concern big time for some of my clients.
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They come in and we spend a session discussing how to um like come up with the plan so that you know, okay, by this you have these applications in for scholarships.
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You see, you know, discuss what kind of other avenues you can open up for scholarships, because some of them, because of the way that their parents are making money, they didn't apply necessarily for certain financial aid because they were considered too rich for it, right?
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So it was kind of like, okay, so we just worked on other plans.
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What other avenues can you open up?
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You know, to get more, and so that's one thing we used to come up with is game plans on how to do that during sessions.
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And you know, and definitely even in my time, though I remember, because I'm I'm a 42, going on 43-year-old girl here in August, but I still remember, like even college, I remember that even it was expensive back when I was going to school.
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You know, even people found even like, even with in-state tuition, it was still right, it still cost a pretty penny right, but now, but that was one concern that people had, you know, I remember, as I was leaving college eventually, because I graduated in 2004, in December.
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But I remember talks are going on back then were like, you know, they, people were even saying this is not even going to be sustainable in the future.
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Yeah, and it certainly isn't.
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We're in the future and it's not sustainable.
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Yep, and it certainly isn't.
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We're in the future and it's not sustainable, but the other thing I talk about, um one really big thing, is the loneliness epidemic oh, absolutely we're so lonely.
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We are so lonely and the data is mixed on it but and there's anywhere from 50 to 80% of Gen Z reports feeling persistently lonely, so it's like at least half my generation feels very lonely, according to different surveys that they've put out, and that's frightening.
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But honestly, when you look at the way we've structured our cities, the way we've addressed community and belonging, it makes sense why it's happening.
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Unfortunately, one thing I write about is the way we built our cities, and we built our cities in a way that is essentially a really powerful way to make us lonely.
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And I talk about how the moment we started building our cities for cars was the moment we started disconnecting as a society, because walkability and environment is just huge for connection and belonging and community and and so that's one huge thing is that we are very isolated and disconnected, and it's ironic because we're the most connected we've ever been online.
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And so, yeah, I get angry, honestly, whenever older generations want to chop it all up and say that the mental health crisis is solely due to the social media and the internet.
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I get mad about it because I believe that the internet, social media, video games, all of it it's a form of escapism, and what's interesting is that the last pillar I talk about meaning they find that when people are on social media, it's directly correlated to lower perceived life purpose, especially for adolescents, and so I don't believe that social media is necessarily the root cause, but I believe it's a mirror to society and what's been happening and it's a way we've been escaping from this lack of purpose and meaning, and so a lot of us sit there and we brain rot all day, but we don't actually put ourselves out there to have hobbies and find community and meaning, and it's just much easier to stay on our phones than it is to actually go out and form those relationships and and purpose in life.
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Hmm, because here's the thing, though, and I mean, and I can understand, you know, like you know, I, I see where you're coming from, but at the same time, I really do believe that the internet and social media also play a role in people's mental health.
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Oh yeah, and you know, there is a thing like FOMO, what we call FOMO fear of missing out.
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It's a thing that drives many people to therapist's office and are, you know, and people get so afraid of not being invited or thinking everybody has it better than them, because they see a picture.
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And I'll tell you this, the amount of times I've had to say don't compare your life to somebody's social media post.
00:25:02.561 --> 00:25:09.027
If I had a dollar for every time I had to say that I could be happily retired by now.
00:25:09.027 --> 00:25:15.278
Right, because it is so prevalent, and you know, I think that too.
00:25:15.337 --> 00:25:21.746
You know well, definitely, you know things change with time, right, cars way, communities changed.
00:25:21.746 --> 00:25:26.250
You know, things were evolving with economics and evolving with times.
00:25:26.250 --> 00:25:48.279
You know, and I think some of this loneliness factor too, I think people get more lonely because there's more destruction, right, these phones can provide an outlet for distraction, kind of like, going to your point, what you're saying about escape, you know, and because before, when older generations are growing up, we didn't have phones or internet.
00:25:48.279 --> 00:26:05.297
We were forced to play outside, right, like that's what a lot of people talk about as well as you know, we were forced to go ride bikes or go to the park, go to camps, you know many people, their parents had a rule that they had to go outside and not come back until a certain amount of time.
00:26:05.297 --> 00:26:08.843
Right, and you know.
00:26:08.843 --> 00:26:24.119
I think you know it's just what it looks like, and even though, yes, there was probably people who were lonely back then, I think perhaps what loneliness looked like for people in different times of life changed.
00:26:25.805 --> 00:26:30.505
Yeah, I will say I'm sure you know who mother Teresa is, absolutely.
00:26:30.505 --> 00:26:33.335
She gave a speech in 1950.
00:26:33.335 --> 00:26:41.662
That was about how loneliness is one of the worst problems ever and that was in 1950 and obviously the Beatles.
00:26:41.701 --> 00:26:44.390
They wrote Eleanor Rigby, which was about loneliness.
00:26:44.390 --> 00:26:48.059
I believe loneliness has been around for a long time.
00:26:48.059 --> 00:27:01.497
I think now we feel it more severely and it's more impactful and more people are experiencing it because so many of us are isolated in our communities.
00:27:01.497 --> 00:27:12.836
We've had a decline in third spaces, a lot of the places where people used to go, like church or even in the workplace, that a lot of people have, you know, a social life within the workplace.
00:27:12.836 --> 00:27:25.479
A lot of that's happened with how we've structured work, to be more online, working from home, and then obviously, third spaces, like church, and there's been a huge uptick in coffee shops.
00:27:25.479 --> 00:27:31.988
I don't know if you notice in your city, but they're like popping up everywhere, I believe, to address the loneliness epidemic.
00:27:31.988 --> 00:28:07.550
A lot of people like to go to places like coffee shops and libraries and things like that for that connection and I think it is sort of like a pendulum sling that's slowly happening and I know the makers of Eventbrite had even reported there's been an uptick in events for young people, like in speed dating and yoga and retreats and just social activities in general for young people, and I think what's interesting is obviously all of this technology is still very new and I think there's been this learning curve of like, okay, this is working.
00:28:07.550 --> 00:28:24.786
This is not working because, if you think about it, technology is this incredible tool, this amazing tool, and the thing I talk about is that if all of social media and tiktok was just science videos and cat videos and cute dogs, we wouldn't be here.
00:28:25.446 --> 00:28:29.365
But the thing is is that it's mirroring a culture that's existed forever.
00:28:29.365 --> 00:28:31.351
We've been sexist forever.
00:28:31.351 --> 00:28:33.076
Sex has sold forever.
00:28:33.076 --> 00:28:36.967
You know, diet culture has been huge forever.
00:28:36.967 --> 00:28:42.008
I mean, you look at pictures in the 1800s of corsets, of those ads in the newspaper.
00:28:42.008 --> 00:28:44.122
It's been here forever.
00:28:44.122 --> 00:28:46.843
Now it's just everyone has access to it.
00:28:46.843 --> 00:28:51.066
Not everyone could buy that magazine back then, or you know, etc.
00:28:51.066 --> 00:28:55.583
But what I think is happening is now we're learning.
00:28:55.583 --> 00:29:05.763
Okay, we spend time all day long looking at what you eat in the day videos and people's workout routines and all these people showing their plastic surgery.
00:29:05.763 --> 00:29:07.119
That's not good for us.
00:29:07.119 --> 00:29:19.980
I think we've learned that and I think over time, we can use social media as a really effective tool and it is being used as a tool, but I think over time it's going to get better and better.
00:29:19.980 --> 00:29:23.471
At least, I'm hoping that's the case I, obviously.
00:29:23.471 --> 00:29:25.998
We see gen alpha and the ipad generation.
00:29:25.998 --> 00:29:36.438
We think, oh my god, like we're all doomed, but maybe there is hope right, and it also starts with also being intentional.
00:29:37.219 --> 00:29:46.144
Right, and teaching people intentionality of when they're going online, when they're going to, let's say, they want to go and look at certain social media posts.
00:29:46.144 --> 00:29:52.048
Okay, can you be intentional on what your content is going to, what content you want to focus on?
00:29:52.048 --> 00:29:55.651
Because I actually read this article somewhere.
00:29:55.651 --> 00:30:13.021
Somewhere it said that Instagram, for example, it's becoming more content-based in the sense of it's feeding you what content it thinks you're going to be interested in, based on your posts or based on what you like, right, and things like that.
00:30:13.021 --> 00:30:16.265
And so it's about you know, like anything right?
00:30:16.265 --> 00:30:18.777
We talk about setting intentions for the day.
00:30:18.777 --> 00:30:23.761
What is your intention when you get on social media?
00:30:23.761 --> 00:30:44.342
And if you can get that clarity beforehand before going on these platforms right, the less you allow it to consume, you right, because when you set that intentionality, you control it instead of allowing that, giving it the other having it the other way.
00:30:46.026 --> 00:30:56.006
Absolutely, I think, what's important to talk about when we talk about the increased risk or the increased depression, anxiety, suicide rates.
00:30:56.006 --> 00:30:58.259
It started in 2007.
00:30:59.163 --> 00:31:02.099
And if you look, social media was not a big thing back then.
00:31:02.099 --> 00:31:10.948
I think Facebook and MySpace might have just come out, but Instagram, snapchat, all of those different really big platforms were not out yet.
00:31:10.948 --> 00:31:18.518
But if you look at the media in general, which is my argument in my book, it's the media, not social media.
00:31:18.518 --> 00:31:25.259
I believe the way in which we influence people through the media has been a huge impact on our generation.
00:31:25.259 --> 00:31:28.347
And so you look at 2007,.
00:31:28.347 --> 00:31:29.872
What happened in 2007?
00:31:29.872 --> 00:31:33.980
Well, the great recession started, but the Kardashians launched.
00:31:33.980 --> 00:31:36.044
Paris Hilton was super popular.
00:31:36.044 --> 00:31:38.567
Hannah Montana was big back then.
00:31:38.567 --> 00:31:48.028
Those were the big things influencing young people and a lot of people actually say Hannah Montana, that show was basically the launch of modern day influencers.
00:31:49.414 --> 00:31:58.856
And so that in itself is important to talk about is what was popular when these rates started going up and what was the popular culture.
00:31:58.856 --> 00:32:02.404
And you look, and it, it was those things.
00:32:02.404 --> 00:32:25.071
And then, of course, it's when you put it all together with a economic recession, of, I think, during the economic recession, what was it?
00:32:25.071 --> 00:32:30.988
It was like 10,000 deaths went up that first year in suicide.
00:32:30.988 --> 00:32:39.027
And so you look at, there is such a relationship between economics and mental health.
00:32:41.009 --> 00:32:47.614
Absolutely, because, you know, in 2008, that was when you had that bubble bust, right, you know, you had the market crisis.
00:32:47.614 --> 00:33:03.800
You had, you know, the housing, that bubble burst in that too, in that too, and then you know you had also reforms that grew out of it, like the Dodd-Frank Act that came out subsequently later.
00:33:03.800 --> 00:33:05.122
Right, that you know.
00:33:05.122 --> 00:33:15.920
Put stipulations on banks, put stipulations on financial trading, put stipulations in place.
00:33:15.920 --> 00:33:22.969
You had, you know, definitely, you know.
00:33:23.009 --> 00:33:39.892
Another thing is, too, you know, when you look at history, okay, when the stock market crashed in 1929, right, you know you've heard of there were suicides that happened even back then.
00:33:39.892 --> 00:33:43.213
Right, you know you've heard of, there were suicides that happened even back then.
00:33:43.213 --> 00:34:07.469
Right, because it's like, you know, because people don't know how, you know to adjust in economic uncertainty, right, there's a lot that happens where that people don't understand that if something were to happen, how are they going to be protected?
00:34:07.469 --> 00:34:12.085
Right, and that's kind of a thing that people like a lot of times, you know.
00:34:12.085 --> 00:34:17.829
You know an average person, you know, and they're going with their day to day, right, they're thinking about just the here and now.
00:34:17.829 --> 00:34:30.927
Right, a lot of people don't think about what can happen if something were to go awry right and being vigilant in that sense as well.
00:34:30.927 --> 00:34:45.009
But yes, I mean, but I do see you know how economics and mental health are very strongly correlated together, and I think that's a very poignant point that people overlook more often than not.
00:34:46.896 --> 00:34:49.460
What's also interesting is just environment in general.
00:34:49.460 --> 00:35:08.963
I have this experiment I tell people and I say I want you to imagine two children born in the same city same year, but one grows up surrounded by parks and trees, but the other person grows up in a concrete jungle and there's just no parks, no greenery for miles.
00:35:08.963 --> 00:35:16.221
When you look at them as teenagers, which child do you think is more likely to develop a psychiatric disorder?
00:35:20.005 --> 00:35:33.306
probably the one growing up in the jungle concrete jungle, right, yeah, so the the kid without nature access, uh, is the one that grows up more likely to develop a psychiatric disorder.
00:35:33.306 --> 00:35:55.360
And there was this study in den Denmark and they followed nearly 1 million children over a longitudinal study and they found that the kids that grew up with the least access to green space had a 55% higher risk of developing a psychiatric disorder later in life 55%, wow.
00:35:55.360 --> 00:36:04.943
And so just nature, access to nature is so important for mental health, but it's one thing we are just not building into our society right now.
00:36:04.943 --> 00:36:12.307
We're building our society for cars, for making money, and not for meaning or connection or health.
00:36:14.135 --> 00:36:48.023
And you know it's interesting you say this because I was watching this movie at the Museum of Science and Industry here in Chicago and they were talking about cities of the future and one of the things they were talking about is having more green city, where you are getting more power from solar, having more greenery, having more parks, and they talk about they featured Singapore a lot on there, because Singapore is a city, state country and it, you know.
00:36:48.023 --> 00:37:01.798
They talk about the amount of trees they built as a way because the heat gets so much there, right, but they also have certain systems in place, right, for it to function with.
00:37:01.798 --> 00:37:26.815
You know, even despite the climate, right, and it is, and I can say as a runner here too, it is very healing to be in nature, you know, just having the green, having fresh air, being in the sunlight, being, you know, just breathing in air from the outdoors, right, and it's so important to even have all these elements.
00:37:26.815 --> 00:37:47.682
And I think you know if we can go into a, you know when we're looking ahead, using science to our advantage, right, using these innovations to get more green cities right, and it's going to take time, right, because change takes time, but I really do.
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