May 7, 2025
Jeremy | Chapter 6 - Walk Down that Road
By taking Michelle’s life, Jeremy not only shattered her family’s world—he also took Leo’s freedom.
Now, in an unlikely and unexpected moment—these two men, connected by Michelle Schofield’s murder, speak at last, their conversation heavy with the weight of the past.
Leo offers something unexpected: forgiveness and gratitude. And Jeremy responds with something he’s never truly given before: an apology.
As Gilbert brings Justin the answers he’s been looking for, Justin feels a weight lift. He no longer sees himself as an echo of his father’s worst acts.
And for the first time, Jeremy and Justin begin writing to each other. Their letters reveal a new side of Jeremy—vulnerable, searching, deeply human.
This is not the end of the story. It’s the beginning of something neither man thought possible: a relationship. In the end, redemption isn’t about escaping the truth, but about searching for it, confronting it, and finding the humanity still buried beneath.
For photos and images from each episode, visit:
https://lavaforgood.com/bone-valley/
New episodes of Bone Valley Season 2 will be available every Wednesday wherever you get your podcasts or subscribe to Lava for Good + on Apple Podcasts to binge the whole season, ad-free now.
Bone Valley is a production of Lava for Good Podcasts in association with Signal Co. No1.
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
00:00:09
Speaker 1: In December of twenty twenty four, I returned to Polk County to give a talk about all my reporting in central Florida. It was a cold winter evening in Lakeland, and downtown shimmered with Christmas decorations. I was just about to enter the lobby the Polk Theater when people were already milling about, when I saw a man in a flannel jacket and a leather vest walking toward me on the sidewalk. It was Leo, surprising me. He had a big smile on his face and be hugged right there on the street. It must be pretty surreal being back in Lakeland, I said. Together, we walked into the theater lobby and Leo was swarm by Bone Valley fans who approached him for photos and conversation. I watched him drift through the crowd, chatting with everyone, even a Polk County deputy who said he just finished listening to the podcast. After I finished my talk, I brought Leo onto the stage. So are there any updates that you can share about Leo?
00:01:16
Speaker 2: Well, there's very interesting update where some of you are aware, but mister Schofield, Leo.
00:01:21
Speaker 1: Scofield is here tonight. Yes, Leo, where are you buddy? We sat down next to me and took questions from the audience.
00:01:33
Speaker 3: Leo, can you tell us how you're doing on the day to day, you and Chrissy and with your grand babies. Just tell us about your life, because we are so thrilled to see you here tonight.
00:01:42
Speaker 1: Yeah, thank you so much for that.
00:01:44
Speaker 3: I'm doing great. This is a very surreal moment for me because I was just sitting there thinking he was.
00:01:51
Speaker 1: As graceful as ever, sharing memories of his years in Lakeland and the decades long fight to prove his innocence and thank you Leo. At the end the night, he received a standing ovation and he lingered for more photos with fans. It was late now, and I walked him to his bike. He pulled his helmet down, swung his leg over as Harley Davidson, and fired it up. For a moment, he just sat there, smiling, proud, like a man who had returned to Polk County and finally took back a piece of himself. Then he rode off and I watched the red glow of his tail light disappear into the night. The next time I saw him a month later, he wasn't on a bike. He was in a hospital bed. Leo had been riding his Harley one night, his dog Ashley on the back when a driver made a sudden left turn in front of them. There was no time to stop. Leo suffered an open book pelvis fracture, a torn bladder, a broken back, and shattered hands, wrists, and an ankle. Ashley's injuries were only slightly less severe. Leo told me the pain was unbearable, with plates and screws now holding his body together. He worried about whether he'd ever walk again, let alone play guitar. He was laying in a bed in the living room with the home he now shared with his wife, Chrissy. Due to the severity of Leo's accident, the Florida Parole Commission allowed him to leave the half way house and move home. I'd come to visit Leo partly because something interesting had come up in my ongoing investigation, something I'd never known before and something that could make a difference. I was just telling Leo about it when I got a phone call. I looked at the screen and saw who it was, showed it to Leo, whose eyes widened. Should I take this, I asked him. He nodded and sat up straight.
00:04:10
Speaker 3: Hey you there, Hey, Jeremy.
00:04:22
Speaker 1: Do you my man? I have to have my feet.
00:04:34
Speaker 4: Sru step sorry list in this vastly tear uh see relation a breach Things.
00:05:26
Speaker 1: Bone Valley, Season two, Jeremy, Chapter six, Walk down that Road. The news I was telling Leo that day was about Jeremy. He had called me a few weeks earlier from the new prison he'd been transferred to, and he was in a pretty decent mood. So I asked him a question I'd always been curious about. It was about something he'd said in court when the State of Florida was deciding whether Jeremy's confession was enough to grant Leo a new trial.
00:06:00
Speaker 5: Do you remember in twenty seventeen when they brought you back to the evidentiary hearing, that woman Victoria Avalon, she was the one that questioned you for the state.
00:06:10
Speaker 6: Yeah, she was fashion me.
00:06:12
Speaker 1: In this hearing. Prosecutor of Victoria Avalon approached Jeremy and showed him a picture that she shielded from the gallery.
00:06:20
Speaker 5: You know what her big thing was When she showed you the picture and she said, look at this.
00:06:27
Speaker 1: As soon as Jeremy saw it, he turned his head away. He didn't want to look, said he'd seen it before.
00:06:34
Speaker 3: See it again.
00:06:37
Speaker 4: Is this what you did to Huff?
00:06:41
Speaker 7: No, I didn't hear that answer.
00:06:45
Speaker 4: No I didn't do it.
00:06:48
Speaker 1: I wanted to know what picture Avalon had showed him and what Jeremy really meant when he said, no, I didn't do that.
00:06:56
Speaker 8: Ye showed me a naked picture picture of Michelle.
00:07:00
Speaker 6: Yeah, yeah, Michelle and you.
00:07:02
Speaker 3: You you you said I didn't do that.
00:07:05
Speaker 6: The way the way is the way they was trying to say that I raped her. That's but that's what these people is getting an idea of brom from her.
00:07:13
Speaker 5: So that's what that's what you thought.
00:07:15
Speaker 6: Yeah, she only had a dead picture, no way, No, No, they don't know she had all her clothes on, she had jury on everything. Yeah, I mean, but this is the way they came at me. Would that you know, showing me the picture?
00:07:29
Speaker 9: Right?
00:07:30
Speaker 5: The autopsy reports said there was no sexual anything.
00:07:34
Speaker 3: There's no evidence of that.
00:07:35
Speaker 7: Yeah.
00:07:35
Speaker 6: No, that's well, that's why that's what makes killing me.
00:07:39
Speaker 1: On the stand. He thought that Avalon was accusing him of raping Michelle, that he left her like that naked at the crime scene, something he knew was not true.
00:07:51
Speaker 3: I'm sorry, man, Well I don't. I might be.
00:07:55
Speaker 6: I might. I might do a lot of crazy stuff in my in my life, man, but I ain't. I ain't part there.
00:08:02
Speaker 1: Avalon argued to the judge that when Jeremy said no, I didn't do that, he was recanting his confession, and the Polk County judge agreed. He ruled that Jeremy had recanted, and with that, Leo Schofield was denied a new trial, even though some of Jeremy's last words in the hearing were I killed her.
00:08:25
Speaker 6: I still don't understand why I did it that night. I can't say alcohol did.
00:08:30
Speaker 8: It, where drugs didn't, whatever, because.
00:08:32
Speaker 6: It's still make no ex q C in it.
00:08:34
Speaker 1: No, I don't know. When I went to Leo's house that day after the motorcycle crash, it was to play in the recording of my call with Jeremy so he would finally know for sure that Jeremy didn't recant his confession. The state had gotten it wrong. And the four years I've been talking to Jeremy, he has never once denied killing Michelle. It was when I was standing next to Leo's bed that my phone rang. The caller ID displayed a prison in North Florida. It's Jeremy, I told Leo. Should I pick up?
00:09:22
Speaker 2: Hey?
00:09:22
Speaker 9: You there?
00:09:24
Speaker 1: Leo nodded, Hey, I just got.
00:09:27
Speaker 3: To tell you something. I don't know how you feel about this, but I just happened to be with Leo right now.
00:09:32
Speaker 1: Jeremy was calling from his new prison. He was no longer in solitary confinement. Now he was in protective management with around eighty other inmates like Jeremy who have to be separated from general population for their safety. I told him Leo had been in a serious motorcycle accident with.
00:09:51
Speaker 3: All these broken bones. Is he gonna be all right?
00:09:56
Speaker 5: I don't know, man, I think he's going to be all right. He's very coherent, but he's got a lot of broken bones. You want to say hello to him.
00:10:05
Speaker 1: I put the phone on speaker and held it out in front of Leo, who screwed it up in his bed.
00:10:10
Speaker 3: He's right here, Hey, Jeremy, how are you? Bud? I was in a motorcycle action with my daughter and got broken up.
00:10:20
Speaker 1: Leo explained the accident, how he and his daughter had both suffered serious injuries. There was a nervous energy between them, an awkwardness and the small talk, but Leo didn't linger there. He got right to the point.
00:10:39
Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm going to have to do that all over again, Jeremy. I want to tell you something, and this is coming from a long time of prayer and you know, just a lot of thought. And I'm grateful for the opportunity to thank you for telling the truth. I want you to know that I forgive you with all my heart.
00:11:01
Speaker 1: Silence stretched on the other end, as Leo continued, you.
00:11:05
Speaker 3: Got a lot of people that care about you now because you did the right thing. And uh, it means a lot to me, it means a lot to my family. And uh, I thank you for that, and thank you with all my heart, Bud.
00:11:18
Speaker 6: I thank you, bro.
00:11:21
Speaker 1: In one of his letters, Jeremy had written, I hope someday I will come face to face with Leo so I can look at him and say I'm sorry for what I did. But now on the phone, Jeremy seemed lost for words, his nervousness filling the silence. Leo guided him almost instinctively, helping a fellow inmate steady himself.
00:11:46
Speaker 3: Hey, I heard you met Oscar good friends. Yeah, he misses you me. He he called me last week. He told me when you were leave and he uh, he missed coming by and seeing you. But I'm glad you're out of there, buddy. You got stay out of trouble man.
00:12:01
Speaker 6: You know, and of buried me there thirty six years. I don't know, man, I mean it's getting.
00:12:09
Speaker 3: To me now.
00:12:09
Speaker 6: I guess I don't know.
00:12:11
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, I hear you. I definitely hear you.
00:12:16
Speaker 1: Leo knew that number too well. It was how long he had waited for freedom. Jeremy talked about his recent transfer and the struggles adjusting to life there. Leo listened, his concern genuine.
00:12:31
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's just a step down phase complete it so you can get out. You'll get out of there. You know you'll get out of there. You gotta.
00:12:39
Speaker 1: After years in prison, Leo knew how to navigate hardship. He reassured Jeremy that he could get through this.
00:12:47
Speaker 3: So you got You've got friends out here that care about you. They're not going to lie to you. They're not going to tell you short they're not going to tell you stories, none of that stuff. You gained a lot of respect with the people out here, just because you were brave enough to tell the truth. And that was a big deal, Jeremy. That was a really big deal because it changed my life, and I definitely appreciate you for it.
00:13:10
Speaker 1: Leo stared at the phone I was holding.
00:13:12
Speaker 6: In front of him, just taking on this happen, Bro, I really did.
00:13:17
Speaker 1: I just hate it that this happened, Bro, I really did. At that moment, with Jeremy standing at the telephone surrounded by other inmates, I realized this might be his apology. These were the words he had chosen for a place where any display of vulnerability could be dangerous.
00:13:37
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, I'm sorry it happened at all. But now it's your turn to stop doing right, you hear me. You just keep doing your part and you're gonna be all right. Okay.
00:13:52
Speaker 6: I had changed my life over and that thought.
00:13:55
Speaker 3: I'd never do that. I believe in you, Jeremy. You're going to do well. You hear me.
00:14:03
Speaker 1: You keep praying for me, he tells Leo.
00:14:07
Speaker 3: I will won't stop, Jeremy, I promise.
00:14:11
Speaker 1: Leo handed me my phone and I told Jeremy goodbye for now, said we talk again. Later, just as I was about to end the call. I thought I heard his voice again, mister King. I put the phone to my ear. Jeremy was still there.
00:14:28
Speaker 5: Hey, Jeremy, can you Yeah, Hey, I'm glad you got a chance.
00:14:33
Speaker 1: Okay, thank you, my pleasure there, he said, I really thank you for that.
00:14:41
Speaker 3: Thank you for using global telling.
00:14:46
Speaker 4: He was getting chumped up.
00:14:48
Speaker 8: Thank you, Joy.
00:14:49
Speaker 6: That was feing weird.
00:14:50
Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm thinking as I've been going, I'm thinking, now this is my wife's martyr. Yeah, I know, I know, I know. It doesn't get more real than that.
00:15:02
Speaker 10: You know.
00:15:04
Speaker 3: I was praying and I told God, I said, I'm gonna forgive him because I know that's what you want me to do. But the test of that was today.
00:15:19
Speaker 1: Later on, Jeremy called me again.
00:15:23
Speaker 3: Hello hear me? Yeah, hey hey.
00:15:30
Speaker 1: I asked if it helped hearing Leo's words, and I ain't gonna lie.
00:15:34
Speaker 6: I mean, it really freaked me out talking to him, but it made me feel a lot better.
00:15:40
Speaker 8: No, well, I near it broke me down, No, dude, I get I get very good emotional, you know. Yeah, but to hear him be free was really really touching, you know, because because he never de started to be in prison, like the tape doesn't.
00:15:59
Speaker 1: Mean he says his life's been taken because of me. Yeah, Jeremy knows he took Michelle Scofield's life too. Forever. He's spoken to me many times about Michelle and her family with what I understand as sincere remorse. It reminds me of some condemned men moments from execution, who in their final words, attempt to ease the suffering they caused. Listening to Jeremy now, I couldn't help but think of Michelle's family and whether his contrition might possibly offer a tiny measure of consolation.
00:16:59
Speaker 7: Sorry, tearing my nose off when I get nervous.
00:17:03
Speaker 1: It's been tough finding time to meet with Justin lately. He'd been so busy with work and caring for his kids with Ariel. To make things easier, they move north, back to Lakeland so they have more family support. Now Justin's mom, Jamie, is there for his kids in ways she wasn't always able to be there for him in the past.
00:17:25
Speaker 7: What I want out of her is to be more involved with the grandkids, like I want her to make up her past with the grandkids.
00:17:33
Speaker 10: That would mean more to me than anything you know because we know where we're at.
00:17:38
Speaker 1: When I first met Justin, I could tell how excited he was about going down this path with me. He wanted to solve all the mysteries about how he came into the world, to know everything, but I wanted to deliver the details gently. So I promised Justin I'd come back to him with everything I'd learned, especially from his mom, and now it was time for him to hear it. Okay, so I'm just going to give you some some some of the things that Jamie said and just talk to you about them. I could tell that Justin was nervous. It was almost like now he was realizing the reason for Jamie's silence over the years. It was hard for Jamie to say some of these things, so it's going to be hard for Justin to hear them. I started from the beginning, so she starts talking about meeting Jeremy at seventeen and the piercing blue eyes.
00:18:36
Speaker 9: The first thing I thought was his eyes. He had the most piercing eyes.
00:18:44
Speaker 1: I told Justin about how Jamie first met Jeremy and why she was drawn to him.
00:18:50
Speaker 9: Well, we found that club secrets. Jeremy came in and none of us had ever seen him before. And we danced and.
00:19:00
Speaker 3: That was it.
00:19:01
Speaker 1: And she talked about learning about his activities and some of the things he used to do was hang around these gay bars, like there was one called Fantasy two thousand and another one called the Green Parrot. Parrots over here, Yeah, you've probably seen me.
00:19:13
Speaker 10: I've been there with him.
00:19:14
Speaker 9: Well, Jeremy he waited outside Green Parrot and they knew he was there and jumped him and he got some of his own medicine.
00:19:23
Speaker 1: I told Justin how Jeremy had done a short stint in prison in nineteen eighty eight for burglary, and how when he'd gotten out, he'd come back into Jamie's life a different person, darker, more violent.
00:19:38
Speaker 9: And that's when his eyes were empty, and there was nothing. I mean, he never smiled, there was no love there.
00:19:46
Speaker 1: It was all fear. I told him about how his mom was with Jeremy when he was arrested for the murder of Donald Morehead and so they put her.
00:19:54
Speaker 9: In the car.
00:19:54
Speaker 11: But she talks about that moment of being in the police car and just like finally it's over. Somebody I need to worry about. I don't need to be threatened by anymore scared of So that was a really big moment in her life to just sort of be free from him that way in because, you know, be able to breathe, and.
00:20:13
Speaker 9: When they shut that door, I could breathe.
00:20:16
Speaker 3: Yeah.
00:20:18
Speaker 1: It occurred to me that Justin might never have known the full story of how he came into this world if his father, Jeremy Scott had never agreed to talk to me, and his mother Jamie might never have opened up. If Justin hadn't reached out wanting to know everything a family.
00:20:35
Speaker 9: He hadn't seen a family brought up right. He's heard about his dad's family, he's seen our family, which is dysfunctional as all get out. And I think in the back of his mind he wanted a family brought up right. He wants his family to be loved and to have the mother and father and to have that dynamic. I'm at core, you know that's what he wants for his kids.
00:21:06
Speaker 2: And Justin's family is growing, and you also mentioned have some good news to tell me, but you're waiting for you to tell me.
00:21:12
Speaker 4: Firston Yeah, all right, yes, so my girl's pregnant.
00:21:16
Speaker 2: Oh man, Yeah, congratulations Justin and his girlfriend Ariel will be welcoming a fifth child into the family.
00:21:26
Speaker 4: I see.
00:21:28
Speaker 9: Him with foul and I see him with those girls, and how good he is, and the fear that he has that he's going to ruin it. Not that something.
00:21:42
Speaker 1: Justin's family has always tried to reassure him, you are not your father, but Jamie's view on this has shifted us.
00:21:50
Speaker 9: He is and for me to tell him he's not his father.
00:21:54
Speaker 10: He knows I'm lying.
00:21:55
Speaker 9: He looks in the mirror and sees his father, you know, because he's seen pictures of his He's googled everything. I've realized he.
00:22:04
Speaker 4: Is his father.
00:22:05
Speaker 10: He's just the good side of Jeremy.
00:22:08
Speaker 9: He's the one that made me realize.
00:22:09
Speaker 2: She wanted you to know that Jeremy also had a good side to him, and that you know that he could be charming, and he could be sweet and caring and empathic at times.
00:22:21
Speaker 1: And she made a point of saying that, like she started looking.
00:22:26
Speaker 10: At it differently when she saw you growing up, Like all the good things she saw out of them.
00:22:30
Speaker 1: Right right.
00:22:31
Speaker 9: I told you he's what Jeremy could have been with a different childhood, if Jeremy had had the love and the nursering and didn't get hit in the head and didn't have the upbringing he had, had the attention he needed, And that's the difference. Jeremy had defend for himself and was pretty much thrown out on the streets when he was a little kid and had to learn how to survive. I don't think Jeremy's an evil person. I really don't, but he does evil things and he always will. He's not going to change, and it's not because he's an evil person. It's because he has no control, he doesn't know how to, and a part of me feel sorry for him.
00:23:24
Speaker 1: There was one part of Jamie's story that I wanted to make sure I got right when I told it to Justin, so I read him what his mom said about the day he was born. She says they went into really, really hard labor and he was in stress. It was just it was scary, and he ended up being in the hospital for like six weeks, and I couldn't hold him like I'm touching.
00:23:48
Speaker 9: I couldn't touch him. And then I would sit there and I would look at him, and I just fell so in love with this baby, and I just knew I just knew.
00:24:02
Speaker 10: He was mine.
00:24:03
Speaker 9: I didn't care who his dad was, I didn't care how he came. That was my baby, that was my child. I think he's one of the best things.
00:24:14
Speaker 1: I've ever done. He really is.
00:24:21
Speaker 9: That little boy has saved me, and I love him so much, and I'm so proud of him and so proud of what he's become.
00:24:33
Speaker 4: In spite of me and in spite of his father. He is one of the most wonderful people.
00:24:45
Speaker 10: I've never heard of talk like that.
00:24:51
Speaker 7: She's always had in trouble expressing her emotions. I knew how she felt. No, she's closed off.
00:25:01
Speaker 10: I don't know.
00:25:02
Speaker 1: I don't know what to think. That made me want to cry some that you know, and I know she loves me.
00:25:10
Speaker 10: I know she loves me.
00:25:29
Speaker 1: Testing one two three, testing one two three. Okay, just saw Justin pull into the parking lot, so he should be up here any second. The very first time I talked to Justin, he told me he wanted to start communicating with his dad.
00:25:43
Speaker 3: Hey, you made it.
00:25:44
Speaker 4: Four minutes late, Okay, you four minutes hold you.
00:25:48
Speaker 1: He wanted to, but he couldn't figure out how he needed my help with the logistics. Ariel wasn't comfortable with the idea of Jeremy sending his letters to Justin at their house. And I think Justin needed my help emotionally too that way.
00:26:03
Speaker 4: But you know, before we.
00:26:04
Speaker 1: Still let me just do this real quick.
00:26:06
Speaker 4: I know I can imagine you are.
00:26:08
Speaker 3: You know.
00:26:08
Speaker 1: The funny thing is Jeremy's kind of excited too, Like I told him that, you know, it's hard to write these letters, And I said, Justin had been trying to write his dad, but each time he tried, he struggled to find the words, you know, or anything.
00:26:23
Speaker 8: And I know so many years I.
00:26:25
Speaker 1: Know, so Jeremy, after waiting weeks for a letter from his son, couldn't wait anymore. He wrote Justin a letter and sent it to me so I could deliver it in person. He asked me to give you this is his handwriting, or is able? That's his everything is his handwriting. I think Justin smiled as I handed in the letter, but as soon as he held it, I saw his eyes start to well up, and all I could think about was how carefully Jeremy had written this letter, how he talked to Mary about finding the right words, about how to say what he really felt. Oh, you cursive.
00:27:06
Speaker 4: Cursive, but I can't write like this.
00:27:08
Speaker 7: You want me to read it out loud?
00:27:09
Speaker 1: Do you mind?
00:27:10
Speaker 3: I don't go for it.
00:27:11
Speaker 4: That's a little nervous. They're justin.
00:27:14
Speaker 7: I was told that you were gonna write me. I guess it's kind of hard for you. We really don't know each other. I would like to get to know you better. I know it's hard for you not knowing what to say. I don't know what you have heard about me. But if you want to ask me something anything, you are a grown man, and I won't lie to you. There's a lot of stuff I did grown up, and I hate myself for those things. I hurt your mother, the only woman to ever loved me, and I hurt my family. I'm fifty four year old now. I have done a lot of thinking since I've been walked up. I gave my whole life away from nothing, but it cost me everything that I love. I don't know how your mother feels about me these thy He still thinks about my mom's Yeah, he does, justin. I'm sorry for not being there for you. I know what it is like growing up with no farther around. I can't change the time. If I could then we would still be a family. Now that makes me happy too, cause he wants you know what I mean, he's not a monster. I have heard that you have a son, that his name is Val and his tears. Oh, mister King has told me that he uh visit with you without Yeah at a playground.
00:28:39
Speaker 4: He told me.
00:28:41
Speaker 7: He told me how you were playing with Val and how the two of you were having fun. I'm glad that you spend time with your son and makes me so happy to hear about that, the.
00:28:54
Speaker 3: Two of you.
00:28:55
Speaker 4: That makes most m ms t.
00:28:58
Speaker 7: Mister King said that you are a very awful young man and then a dedicated father.
00:29:04
Speaker 4: So you work as a manager. That's good.
00:29:07
Speaker 7: Uh, I sure didn't keep us up. Spent a long time since I hear from anyone in my family. When Grandma passed a while back, and I wish you could have spent some time with your great grandma. She saw you back in eight oh, so she did get us. I was told that you would like to meet some of my family. That would be nice. Well soon I wanted to write and hope that this will help you to write me. Just you ask anything that you want. Well, I'm sorry it has taken so long to write, give my grandson to hug a bunch of kisses a day, and that its oh, you take care of yourself.
00:29:55
Speaker 4: Love that. Then he put happy for it for the life.
00:30:02
Speaker 7: I mean, obviously, you know we're past that age of for me being a kid and that and everything.
00:30:07
Speaker 4: But one thing that it makes me have is that connection.
00:30:11
Speaker 1: Feeling like a kid again. Watching Justin read this letter and take in Jeremy's words is complicated for me. This isn't some story about a long lost father reconnecting with his son through a genealogy website. This is different. This is heavy, and I'm always careful to keep expectations low. The father in this story is still locked inside the dead end of prison where he'll spend the rest of his life. But Justin seems to understand this. He's realistic and he wants to give his father a chance.
00:31:10
Speaker 7: Okay, So this was about four or five days ago, cause I started on it and I ain't gonna lie. I went started to the first sentence and then I stopped cause I didn't know what they're right, writer's block, Yeah, And then I wrote it again. So, dear Dad, even as I think of what to write down to start my letter off. I just keep thinking how this is the start of our relationship, which I think is awesome.
00:31:34
Speaker 1: I had Justin and Jeremy keep writing letters to each other. Jeremy mails me his for Justin and I either bring them to his house or take a picture and message them to him. To Justin, dear son, I got your letter, and I was glad you wrote. I really would like to get to know you a lot better. Tell me about you. How far did you go to school? Do you like sports? What kind of music do you like?
00:32:02
Speaker 3: Do Jeremy? Hey, dad?
00:32:05
Speaker 7: I spent majority of my life in Florida, and I want to say I'm book smart, but I'm definitely street smart. I'm talkative and quite at the same time. I pretty much learned to sit back and listen and only talk to learn. I like sports, anime, art, music.
00:32:21
Speaker 4: I like a lot of stuff.
00:32:22
Speaker 7: Well, my brain likes new stuff and I love challenges too. Mind games puzzles are a favorite.
00:32:28
Speaker 1: So tell me how tall are you. I'm about six feet and a half, got all my hair. I'm fifty four years old, same age as your mama. I don't know what all your mother has told you about me. I want to make sure that you understand I love your mom more than anything, and I always will if you talk with her, tell her. I said, hello, Okay, so how is your grandma doing. I'm sure that she told you about what me and your mom did. Took off with the car and then we were all over the state.
00:33:01
Speaker 7: I didn't know he took her car.
00:33:02
Speaker 1: Yeah, they went for some nig long road trip together. Boy was she mad?
00:33:06
Speaker 3: Boy was she mad?
00:33:07
Speaker 7: I bet she was.
00:33:09
Speaker 1: But I think if she was really mad, she would have called the cops faster, but she didn't. Once this communication has opened up, it revealed a side of Jeremy that I'd never truly seen in the four years we've been speaking Between them. There's an openness, almost a giddiness as they begin to learn about each other.
00:33:36
Speaker 7: To Jeremy, hey Dad, I got your letter from Gilbert and I was super excited. We're like pen pals in a way, except this father and his son.
00:33:44
Speaker 1: You were right, were like pen pals. I like that because I don't have many people to write me. I never knew who my father was. I always wanted to meet him, but I never did. I don't even know his name.
00:34:00
Speaker 3: Dear dad.
00:34:01
Speaker 7: I had a stepdad and some other father figures, but never got that father son bond, except with Henry and Todd. Henry was cool and married my grandma, but he died in the sleep. Todd was cool, and he taught me, my brother, Alie, and my sister how to defend ourselves. He had drug problems and got caught Robin Banks. He dated my mom for a bit.
00:34:26
Speaker 1: Dear Justin, I was looking at those pictures you sent of you and Vow. I couldn't stop myself from crying just seeing you with your son. It makes me so happy to see that the two of you together. I know Vow will be in good hands. Enjoy it while you can, because Vow will start growing, and before you know it, he will be a man with kids of his own. There's empathy and remorse, but there's also vulnerability. The raw knee Jeremy. He feels for family, for belonging. He takes pride in knowing his son has not followed the same path he did. He's trying on the role of a father, something he's never known, searching for ways to show love in a way he's never received. I hope one day that I will get to meet both of you, my son and grandson. So tell me about this family of yours.
00:35:30
Speaker 7: I have four kids now, but one of them is from my actual seat, but I love each one of them like they were my own. I've pretty much been winging life up until the point I had Bow, and then I started to learn about being responsible. Life could be amazing and scary as at times. Y'all can say Baul, Mama, Dad and Nana at the moment, and I get excited about the small things with thou.
00:35:58
Speaker 1: Sound like you are ready to walk down that road. She has three kids of her own. As long as you are happy and she is happy, that's all that matters. I'm sorry for not being there for you growing up. I'm glad that you are doing the right thing with your son.
00:36:16
Speaker 7: I'm not mad at you, by the way. I mean, I wish you would have thought before you acted, but we all make mistakes and we val and I appreciate the fact that you were at mad enough to still want to talk with me. I'm very proud of you too, and I'm super excited about you wanting to step forward and face your demons.
00:36:37
Speaker 1: Well son, maybe one day you can come to visit me that would be cool. Well, I hope to hear from you soon. I will close for now. I do love you, son. Don't you forget that.
00:36:50
Speaker 7: I'm standing beside you good, justin.
00:36:53
Speaker 1: Love, Dad, Jeremy.
00:37:10
Speaker 2: No, very early on you said learning all about this would actually help me be a better father. I'm just wondering if you still think about that.
00:37:16
Speaker 7: I think it has made me a better father, because I feel like it evolved from me worrying about me turning into him to me helping him find who he is.
00:37:26
Speaker 10: I don't hear you talking about wondering if you are your dad. I don't even think he's like himself. Now, how can I be like him if he's not like him? You know, you're not the scary Jeremy that everybody thought you was anymore. You're just you're messed up in the head.
00:37:43
Speaker 4: Jeremy.
00:37:44
Speaker 10: You know, and you need love.
00:37:48
Speaker 1: I asked Justin what does he hope to gain by learning his father's story and telling his own.
00:37:55
Speaker 7: I think it's more important to my family than anything else, because not just everybody's been through a lot. You know, it would just be nice for once in life a positive story. You know, if if I could have one positive story from a like a like a super bad situation, like no one in their right mind with everything Jeremy would do at one eighty like nobody. So what happens when you see him? You would want to know his story, right, You want to want to know what happened, what made him change, and to find out it was his heart. You know the hard work he put in, and you know the support team he has behind him, and everything else, it's just people gathering together and caring for one another.
00:38:58
Speaker 1: One of the things I told Justin is what Jeremy fears most. It's not a fear for his safety or his health in prison, but a fear about what will happen after he dies. The thought that haunts him most is being buried in the prison cemetery. And it turns out you'd have to have somebody that claim you, claim your body after your death. I don't want him buried.
00:39:22
Speaker 10: I don't care what state of mind he is or anything.
00:39:25
Speaker 7: I don't want him buried there.
00:39:27
Speaker 1: But he said he didn't think anybody in his immediate family, in putting his mother and his aunts would claim him.
00:39:33
Speaker 7: So he am I allowed to claim him. I think he would be then I'll claim him on that. I'm jumping right on that one, and if I can. Don't want it buried over here. I want him buried close to my other family. Just because someone does something bad doesn't mean they're not a family.
00:39:52
Speaker 9: You know.
00:39:53
Speaker 1: He might not be the father, but he's still my dad.
00:39:56
Speaker 7: But he's going to be buried like a human being.
00:40:00
Speaker 1: At least give him that for the fight he put in.
00:40:14
Speaker 4: Said you were better with talking than writing.
00:40:17
Speaker 1: Let's just do a quick thing here. I just talked to him and I'll write it down afterwards and send it.
00:40:21
Speaker 7: To him just like I act like I'm talking to him. Yeah, Okay, all right there, Jeremy. It's justin your son. I had Christmas and I owne.
00:40:32
Speaker 1: Valley is a production of Lava for Good podcast in association with Signal Company Number one.
00:40:39
Speaker 7: I just got your letter that you wrote to me from Gilbert today too, and it really sucks about not being able to visit yet. But we'll try to set up a thing to go visit soon enough and it will be a lot.
00:40:51
Speaker 1: Our executive producers are Jason Flom, Jeff Kepler, and Kevin Wurdis.
00:40:56
Speaker 7: But I did give permission to talk to you about my daughter. That's going to be. Yeah, I'm kind of starting mown tree kind of thing now. And you know they have a grandfather now to look up for, so you got to make sure you stay in line for them, keep your head.
00:41:12
Speaker 1: Caro Cornhaber is our senior producer. Jackie Pauley and Hannah bial are our producers.
00:41:17
Speaker 2: What do you think?
00:41:18
Speaker 3: What's your prediction for tomorrow?
00:41:19
Speaker 6: Jeremy Kansas City? All day, the history will be made.
00:41:25
Speaker 7: Hey, dad, Sorry for the late response, but Gilbert did really good and gave me your birthday letter rite on my birthday. It really brightened up my day and everything.
00:41:35
Speaker 1: I felt like a little.
00:41:36
Speaker 9: Kid, you know.
00:41:38
Speaker 1: Rit Spangler is our sound designer. Marianne mckuwne is our editor. Fact checking by Dania Suleiman.
00:41:45
Speaker 3: Sure, I got two more bikes, but I don't know if I'll ride them again or not. We'll see.
00:41:50
Speaker 6: It kind of takes your time, that's all. Yeah. Yeah, like putting tricycle wheels on her and just learning, you know.
00:42:00
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, that's a pretty good idea. All right, buddy, You take care of you.
00:42:05
Speaker 1: Jeff Clyburn is our head of Marketing and Operations, our social media director is is Maati Guardrama.
00:42:12
Speaker 7: And Gwinnevere was born.
00:42:14
Speaker 12: She's so beautiful.
00:42:16
Speaker 7: I'll eventually be able to send you.
00:42:17
Speaker 1: Pictures of Our social media manager is Sarah Gibbons and our art director is Andrew Nelson.
00:42:24
Speaker 7: Everything's been going good. I really do care about your dad, and I want to say happy birthday as well.
00:42:31
Speaker 5: I hope you get this before your birthday, but happy birthday, old man.
00:42:35
Speaker 4: I love you justin all right.
00:42:38
Speaker 6: Let Mary know I called you too, for she works.
00:42:40
Speaker 9: I will right now her.
00:42:43
Speaker 8: I said, everything that is good okay, and I'm goost sad her.
00:42:47
Speaker 6: I'm gonna send her a snapshot picture.
00:42:50
Speaker 1: Additional research and production by Kelsey Decker. Additional sound recording by James Johnson.
00:42:56
Speaker 12: He said they just had dinner and it was coas law, two pieces of bread and a rat patty. I said, what's a rat patty? And he said it's a Hamburger patty that has no real bone.
00:43:06
Speaker 1: Valley is written and produced by me Gilbert King. Follow us on Instagram, Facebook, TikTok, and threads at Lava for good.
00:43:15
Speaker 7: Stay good and stay on the right track, all right.
00:43:18
Speaker 3: I love you Dad.
00:43:20
Speaker 7: I don't know why I said bye.
00:43:24
Speaker 2: That was like a letter.
00:43:25
Speaker 4: Then you beat your head
Speaker 1: In December of twenty twenty four, I returned to Polk County to give a talk about all my reporting in central Florida. It was a cold winter evening in Lakeland, and downtown shimmered with Christmas decorations. I was just about to enter the lobby the Polk Theater when people were already milling about, when I saw a man in a flannel jacket and a leather vest walking toward me on the sidewalk. It was Leo, surprising me. He had a big smile on his face and be hugged right there on the street. It must be pretty surreal being back in Lakeland, I said. Together, we walked into the theater lobby and Leo was swarm by Bone Valley fans who approached him for photos and conversation. I watched him drift through the crowd, chatting with everyone, even a Polk County deputy who said he just finished listening to the podcast. After I finished my talk, I brought Leo onto the stage. So are there any updates that you can share about Leo?
00:01:16
Speaker 2: Well, there's very interesting update where some of you are aware, but mister Schofield, Leo.
00:01:21
Speaker 1: Scofield is here tonight. Yes, Leo, where are you buddy? We sat down next to me and took questions from the audience.
00:01:33
Speaker 3: Leo, can you tell us how you're doing on the day to day, you and Chrissy and with your grand babies. Just tell us about your life, because we are so thrilled to see you here tonight.
00:01:42
Speaker 1: Yeah, thank you so much for that.
00:01:44
Speaker 3: I'm doing great. This is a very surreal moment for me because I was just sitting there thinking he was.
00:01:51
Speaker 1: As graceful as ever, sharing memories of his years in Lakeland and the decades long fight to prove his innocence and thank you Leo. At the end the night, he received a standing ovation and he lingered for more photos with fans. It was late now, and I walked him to his bike. He pulled his helmet down, swung his leg over as Harley Davidson, and fired it up. For a moment, he just sat there, smiling, proud, like a man who had returned to Polk County and finally took back a piece of himself. Then he rode off and I watched the red glow of his tail light disappear into the night. The next time I saw him a month later, he wasn't on a bike. He was in a hospital bed. Leo had been riding his Harley one night, his dog Ashley on the back when a driver made a sudden left turn in front of them. There was no time to stop. Leo suffered an open book pelvis fracture, a torn bladder, a broken back, and shattered hands, wrists, and an ankle. Ashley's injuries were only slightly less severe. Leo told me the pain was unbearable, with plates and screws now holding his body together. He worried about whether he'd ever walk again, let alone play guitar. He was laying in a bed in the living room with the home he now shared with his wife, Chrissy. Due to the severity of Leo's accident, the Florida Parole Commission allowed him to leave the half way house and move home. I'd come to visit Leo partly because something interesting had come up in my ongoing investigation, something I'd never known before and something that could make a difference. I was just telling Leo about it when I got a phone call. I looked at the screen and saw who it was, showed it to Leo, whose eyes widened. Should I take this, I asked him. He nodded and sat up straight.
00:04:10
Speaker 3: Hey you there, Hey, Jeremy.
00:04:22
Speaker 1: Do you my man? I have to have my feet.
00:04:34
Speaker 4: Sru step sorry list in this vastly tear uh see relation a breach Things.
00:05:26
Speaker 1: Bone Valley, Season two, Jeremy, Chapter six, Walk down that Road. The news I was telling Leo that day was about Jeremy. He had called me a few weeks earlier from the new prison he'd been transferred to, and he was in a pretty decent mood. So I asked him a question I'd always been curious about. It was about something he'd said in court when the State of Florida was deciding whether Jeremy's confession was enough to grant Leo a new trial.
00:06:00
Speaker 5: Do you remember in twenty seventeen when they brought you back to the evidentiary hearing, that woman Victoria Avalon, she was the one that questioned you for the state.
00:06:10
Speaker 6: Yeah, she was fashion me.
00:06:12
Speaker 1: In this hearing. Prosecutor of Victoria Avalon approached Jeremy and showed him a picture that she shielded from the gallery.
00:06:20
Speaker 5: You know what her big thing was When she showed you the picture and she said, look at this.
00:06:27
Speaker 1: As soon as Jeremy saw it, he turned his head away. He didn't want to look, said he'd seen it before.
00:06:34
Speaker 3: See it again.
00:06:37
Speaker 4: Is this what you did to Huff?
00:06:41
Speaker 7: No, I didn't hear that answer.
00:06:45
Speaker 4: No I didn't do it.
00:06:48
Speaker 1: I wanted to know what picture Avalon had showed him and what Jeremy really meant when he said, no, I didn't do that.
00:06:56
Speaker 8: Ye showed me a naked picture picture of Michelle.
00:07:00
Speaker 6: Yeah, yeah, Michelle and you.
00:07:02
Speaker 3: You you you said I didn't do that.
00:07:05
Speaker 6: The way the way is the way they was trying to say that I raped her. That's but that's what these people is getting an idea of brom from her.
00:07:13
Speaker 5: So that's what that's what you thought.
00:07:15
Speaker 6: Yeah, she only had a dead picture, no way, No, No, they don't know she had all her clothes on, she had jury on everything. Yeah, I mean, but this is the way they came at me. Would that you know, showing me the picture?
00:07:29
Speaker 9: Right?
00:07:30
Speaker 5: The autopsy reports said there was no sexual anything.
00:07:34
Speaker 3: There's no evidence of that.
00:07:35
Speaker 7: Yeah.
00:07:35
Speaker 6: No, that's well, that's why that's what makes killing me.
00:07:39
Speaker 1: On the stand. He thought that Avalon was accusing him of raping Michelle, that he left her like that naked at the crime scene, something he knew was not true.
00:07:51
Speaker 3: I'm sorry, man, Well I don't. I might be.
00:07:55
Speaker 6: I might. I might do a lot of crazy stuff in my in my life, man, but I ain't. I ain't part there.
00:08:02
Speaker 1: Avalon argued to the judge that when Jeremy said no, I didn't do that, he was recanting his confession, and the Polk County judge agreed. He ruled that Jeremy had recanted, and with that, Leo Schofield was denied a new trial, even though some of Jeremy's last words in the hearing were I killed her.
00:08:25
Speaker 6: I still don't understand why I did it that night. I can't say alcohol did.
00:08:30
Speaker 8: It, where drugs didn't, whatever, because.
00:08:32
Speaker 6: It's still make no ex q C in it.
00:08:34
Speaker 1: No, I don't know. When I went to Leo's house that day after the motorcycle crash, it was to play in the recording of my call with Jeremy so he would finally know for sure that Jeremy didn't recant his confession. The state had gotten it wrong. And the four years I've been talking to Jeremy, he has never once denied killing Michelle. It was when I was standing next to Leo's bed that my phone rang. The caller ID displayed a prison in North Florida. It's Jeremy, I told Leo. Should I pick up?
00:09:22
Speaker 2: Hey?
00:09:22
Speaker 9: You there?
00:09:24
Speaker 1: Leo nodded, Hey, I just got.
00:09:27
Speaker 3: To tell you something. I don't know how you feel about this, but I just happened to be with Leo right now.
00:09:32
Speaker 1: Jeremy was calling from his new prison. He was no longer in solitary confinement. Now he was in protective management with around eighty other inmates like Jeremy who have to be separated from general population for their safety. I told him Leo had been in a serious motorcycle accident with.
00:09:51
Speaker 3: All these broken bones. Is he gonna be all right?
00:09:56
Speaker 5: I don't know, man, I think he's going to be all right. He's very coherent, but he's got a lot of broken bones. You want to say hello to him.
00:10:05
Speaker 1: I put the phone on speaker and held it out in front of Leo, who screwed it up in his bed.
00:10:10
Speaker 3: He's right here, Hey, Jeremy, how are you? Bud? I was in a motorcycle action with my daughter and got broken up.
00:10:20
Speaker 1: Leo explained the accident, how he and his daughter had both suffered serious injuries. There was a nervous energy between them, an awkwardness and the small talk, but Leo didn't linger there. He got right to the point.
00:10:39
Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm going to have to do that all over again, Jeremy. I want to tell you something, and this is coming from a long time of prayer and you know, just a lot of thought. And I'm grateful for the opportunity to thank you for telling the truth. I want you to know that I forgive you with all my heart.
00:11:01
Speaker 1: Silence stretched on the other end, as Leo continued, you.
00:11:05
Speaker 3: Got a lot of people that care about you now because you did the right thing. And uh, it means a lot to me, it means a lot to my family. And uh, I thank you for that, and thank you with all my heart, Bud.
00:11:18
Speaker 6: I thank you, bro.
00:11:21
Speaker 1: In one of his letters, Jeremy had written, I hope someday I will come face to face with Leo so I can look at him and say I'm sorry for what I did. But now on the phone, Jeremy seemed lost for words, his nervousness filling the silence. Leo guided him almost instinctively, helping a fellow inmate steady himself.
00:11:46
Speaker 3: Hey, I heard you met Oscar good friends. Yeah, he misses you me. He he called me last week. He told me when you were leave and he uh, he missed coming by and seeing you. But I'm glad you're out of there, buddy. You got stay out of trouble man.
00:12:01
Speaker 6: You know, and of buried me there thirty six years. I don't know, man, I mean it's getting.
00:12:09
Speaker 3: To me now.
00:12:09
Speaker 6: I guess I don't know.
00:12:11
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, I hear you. I definitely hear you.
00:12:16
Speaker 1: Leo knew that number too well. It was how long he had waited for freedom. Jeremy talked about his recent transfer and the struggles adjusting to life there. Leo listened, his concern genuine.
00:12:31
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's just a step down phase complete it so you can get out. You'll get out of there. You know you'll get out of there. You gotta.
00:12:39
Speaker 1: After years in prison, Leo knew how to navigate hardship. He reassured Jeremy that he could get through this.
00:12:47
Speaker 3: So you got You've got friends out here that care about you. They're not going to lie to you. They're not going to tell you short they're not going to tell you stories, none of that stuff. You gained a lot of respect with the people out here, just because you were brave enough to tell the truth. And that was a big deal, Jeremy. That was a really big deal because it changed my life, and I definitely appreciate you for it.
00:13:10
Speaker 1: Leo stared at the phone I was holding.
00:13:12
Speaker 6: In front of him, just taking on this happen, Bro, I really did.
00:13:17
Speaker 1: I just hate it that this happened, Bro, I really did. At that moment, with Jeremy standing at the telephone surrounded by other inmates, I realized this might be his apology. These were the words he had chosen for a place where any display of vulnerability could be dangerous.
00:13:37
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, I'm sorry it happened at all. But now it's your turn to stop doing right, you hear me. You just keep doing your part and you're gonna be all right. Okay.
00:13:52
Speaker 6: I had changed my life over and that thought.
00:13:55
Speaker 3: I'd never do that. I believe in you, Jeremy. You're going to do well. You hear me.
00:14:03
Speaker 1: You keep praying for me, he tells Leo.
00:14:07
Speaker 3: I will won't stop, Jeremy, I promise.
00:14:11
Speaker 1: Leo handed me my phone and I told Jeremy goodbye for now, said we talk again. Later, just as I was about to end the call. I thought I heard his voice again, mister King. I put the phone to my ear. Jeremy was still there.
00:14:28
Speaker 5: Hey, Jeremy, can you Yeah, Hey, I'm glad you got a chance.
00:14:33
Speaker 1: Okay, thank you, my pleasure there, he said, I really thank you for that.
00:14:41
Speaker 3: Thank you for using global telling.
00:14:46
Speaker 4: He was getting chumped up.
00:14:48
Speaker 8: Thank you, Joy.
00:14:49
Speaker 6: That was feing weird.
00:14:50
Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm thinking as I've been going, I'm thinking, now this is my wife's martyr. Yeah, I know, I know, I know. It doesn't get more real than that.
00:15:02
Speaker 10: You know.
00:15:04
Speaker 3: I was praying and I told God, I said, I'm gonna forgive him because I know that's what you want me to do. But the test of that was today.
00:15:19
Speaker 1: Later on, Jeremy called me again.
00:15:23
Speaker 3: Hello hear me? Yeah, hey hey.
00:15:30
Speaker 1: I asked if it helped hearing Leo's words, and I ain't gonna lie.
00:15:34
Speaker 6: I mean, it really freaked me out talking to him, but it made me feel a lot better.
00:15:40
Speaker 8: No, well, I near it broke me down, No, dude, I get I get very good emotional, you know. Yeah, but to hear him be free was really really touching, you know, because because he never de started to be in prison, like the tape doesn't.
00:15:59
Speaker 1: Mean he says his life's been taken because of me. Yeah, Jeremy knows he took Michelle Scofield's life too. Forever. He's spoken to me many times about Michelle and her family with what I understand as sincere remorse. It reminds me of some condemned men moments from execution, who in their final words, attempt to ease the suffering they caused. Listening to Jeremy now, I couldn't help but think of Michelle's family and whether his contrition might possibly offer a tiny measure of consolation.
00:16:59
Speaker 7: Sorry, tearing my nose off when I get nervous.
00:17:03
Speaker 1: It's been tough finding time to meet with Justin lately. He'd been so busy with work and caring for his kids with Ariel. To make things easier, they move north, back to Lakeland so they have more family support. Now Justin's mom, Jamie, is there for his kids in ways she wasn't always able to be there for him in the past.
00:17:25
Speaker 7: What I want out of her is to be more involved with the grandkids, like I want her to make up her past with the grandkids.
00:17:33
Speaker 10: That would mean more to me than anything you know because we know where we're at.
00:17:38
Speaker 1: When I first met Justin, I could tell how excited he was about going down this path with me. He wanted to solve all the mysteries about how he came into the world, to know everything, but I wanted to deliver the details gently. So I promised Justin I'd come back to him with everything I'd learned, especially from his mom, and now it was time for him to hear it. Okay, so I'm just going to give you some some some of the things that Jamie said and just talk to you about them. I could tell that Justin was nervous. It was almost like now he was realizing the reason for Jamie's silence over the years. It was hard for Jamie to say some of these things, so it's going to be hard for Justin to hear them. I started from the beginning, so she starts talking about meeting Jeremy at seventeen and the piercing blue eyes.
00:18:36
Speaker 9: The first thing I thought was his eyes. He had the most piercing eyes.
00:18:44
Speaker 1: I told Justin about how Jamie first met Jeremy and why she was drawn to him.
00:18:50
Speaker 9: Well, we found that club secrets. Jeremy came in and none of us had ever seen him before. And we danced and.
00:19:00
Speaker 3: That was it.
00:19:01
Speaker 1: And she talked about learning about his activities and some of the things he used to do was hang around these gay bars, like there was one called Fantasy two thousand and another one called the Green Parrot. Parrots over here, Yeah, you've probably seen me.
00:19:13
Speaker 10: I've been there with him.
00:19:14
Speaker 9: Well, Jeremy he waited outside Green Parrot and they knew he was there and jumped him and he got some of his own medicine.
00:19:23
Speaker 1: I told Justin how Jeremy had done a short stint in prison in nineteen eighty eight for burglary, and how when he'd gotten out, he'd come back into Jamie's life a different person, darker, more violent.
00:19:38
Speaker 9: And that's when his eyes were empty, and there was nothing. I mean, he never smiled, there was no love there.
00:19:46
Speaker 1: It was all fear. I told him about how his mom was with Jeremy when he was arrested for the murder of Donald Morehead and so they put her.
00:19:54
Speaker 9: In the car.
00:19:54
Speaker 11: But she talks about that moment of being in the police car and just like finally it's over. Somebody I need to worry about. I don't need to be threatened by anymore scared of So that was a really big moment in her life to just sort of be free from him that way in because, you know, be able to breathe, and.
00:20:13
Speaker 9: When they shut that door, I could breathe.
00:20:16
Speaker 3: Yeah.
00:20:18
Speaker 1: It occurred to me that Justin might never have known the full story of how he came into this world if his father, Jeremy Scott had never agreed to talk to me, and his mother Jamie might never have opened up. If Justin hadn't reached out wanting to know everything a family.
00:20:35
Speaker 9: He hadn't seen a family brought up right. He's heard about his dad's family, he's seen our family, which is dysfunctional as all get out. And I think in the back of his mind he wanted a family brought up right. He wants his family to be loved and to have the mother and father and to have that dynamic. I'm at core, you know that's what he wants for his kids.
00:21:06
Speaker 2: And Justin's family is growing, and you also mentioned have some good news to tell me, but you're waiting for you to tell me.
00:21:12
Speaker 4: Firston Yeah, all right, yes, so my girl's pregnant.
00:21:16
Speaker 2: Oh man, Yeah, congratulations Justin and his girlfriend Ariel will be welcoming a fifth child into the family.
00:21:26
Speaker 4: I see.
00:21:28
Speaker 9: Him with foul and I see him with those girls, and how good he is, and the fear that he has that he's going to ruin it. Not that something.
00:21:42
Speaker 1: Justin's family has always tried to reassure him, you are not your father, but Jamie's view on this has shifted us.
00:21:50
Speaker 9: He is and for me to tell him he's not his father.
00:21:54
Speaker 10: He knows I'm lying.
00:21:55
Speaker 9: He looks in the mirror and sees his father, you know, because he's seen pictures of his He's googled everything. I've realized he.
00:22:04
Speaker 4: Is his father.
00:22:05
Speaker 10: He's just the good side of Jeremy.
00:22:08
Speaker 9: He's the one that made me realize.
00:22:09
Speaker 2: She wanted you to know that Jeremy also had a good side to him, and that you know that he could be charming, and he could be sweet and caring and empathic at times.
00:22:21
Speaker 1: And she made a point of saying that, like she started looking.
00:22:26
Speaker 10: At it differently when she saw you growing up, Like all the good things she saw out of them.
00:22:30
Speaker 1: Right right.
00:22:31
Speaker 9: I told you he's what Jeremy could have been with a different childhood, if Jeremy had had the love and the nursering and didn't get hit in the head and didn't have the upbringing he had, had the attention he needed, And that's the difference. Jeremy had defend for himself and was pretty much thrown out on the streets when he was a little kid and had to learn how to survive. I don't think Jeremy's an evil person. I really don't, but he does evil things and he always will. He's not going to change, and it's not because he's an evil person. It's because he has no control, he doesn't know how to, and a part of me feel sorry for him.
00:23:24
Speaker 1: There was one part of Jamie's story that I wanted to make sure I got right when I told it to Justin, so I read him what his mom said about the day he was born. She says they went into really, really hard labor and he was in stress. It was just it was scary, and he ended up being in the hospital for like six weeks, and I couldn't hold him like I'm touching.
00:23:48
Speaker 9: I couldn't touch him. And then I would sit there and I would look at him, and I just fell so in love with this baby, and I just knew I just knew.
00:24:02
Speaker 10: He was mine.
00:24:03
Speaker 9: I didn't care who his dad was, I didn't care how he came. That was my baby, that was my child. I think he's one of the best things.
00:24:14
Speaker 1: I've ever done. He really is.
00:24:21
Speaker 9: That little boy has saved me, and I love him so much, and I'm so proud of him and so proud of what he's become.
00:24:33
Speaker 4: In spite of me and in spite of his father. He is one of the most wonderful people.
00:24:45
Speaker 10: I've never heard of talk like that.
00:24:51
Speaker 7: She's always had in trouble expressing her emotions. I knew how she felt. No, she's closed off.
00:25:01
Speaker 10: I don't know.
00:25:02
Speaker 1: I don't know what to think. That made me want to cry some that you know, and I know she loves me.
00:25:10
Speaker 10: I know she loves me.
00:25:29
Speaker 1: Testing one two three, testing one two three. Okay, just saw Justin pull into the parking lot, so he should be up here any second. The very first time I talked to Justin, he told me he wanted to start communicating with his dad.
00:25:43
Speaker 3: Hey, you made it.
00:25:44
Speaker 4: Four minutes late, Okay, you four minutes hold you.
00:25:48
Speaker 1: He wanted to, but he couldn't figure out how he needed my help with the logistics. Ariel wasn't comfortable with the idea of Jeremy sending his letters to Justin at their house. And I think Justin needed my help emotionally too that way.
00:26:03
Speaker 4: But you know, before we.
00:26:04
Speaker 1: Still let me just do this real quick.
00:26:06
Speaker 4: I know I can imagine you are.
00:26:08
Speaker 3: You know.
00:26:08
Speaker 1: The funny thing is Jeremy's kind of excited too, Like I told him that, you know, it's hard to write these letters, And I said, Justin had been trying to write his dad, but each time he tried, he struggled to find the words, you know, or anything.
00:26:23
Speaker 8: And I know so many years I.
00:26:25
Speaker 1: Know, so Jeremy, after waiting weeks for a letter from his son, couldn't wait anymore. He wrote Justin a letter and sent it to me so I could deliver it in person. He asked me to give you this is his handwriting, or is able? That's his everything is his handwriting. I think Justin smiled as I handed in the letter, but as soon as he held it, I saw his eyes start to well up, and all I could think about was how carefully Jeremy had written this letter, how he talked to Mary about finding the right words, about how to say what he really felt. Oh, you cursive.
00:27:06
Speaker 4: Cursive, but I can't write like this.
00:27:08
Speaker 7: You want me to read it out loud?
00:27:09
Speaker 1: Do you mind?
00:27:10
Speaker 3: I don't go for it.
00:27:11
Speaker 4: That's a little nervous. They're justin.
00:27:14
Speaker 7: I was told that you were gonna write me. I guess it's kind of hard for you. We really don't know each other. I would like to get to know you better. I know it's hard for you not knowing what to say. I don't know what you have heard about me. But if you want to ask me something anything, you are a grown man, and I won't lie to you. There's a lot of stuff I did grown up, and I hate myself for those things. I hurt your mother, the only woman to ever loved me, and I hurt my family. I'm fifty four year old now. I have done a lot of thinking since I've been walked up. I gave my whole life away from nothing, but it cost me everything that I love. I don't know how your mother feels about me these thy He still thinks about my mom's Yeah, he does, justin. I'm sorry for not being there for you. I know what it is like growing up with no farther around. I can't change the time. If I could then we would still be a family. Now that makes me happy too, cause he wants you know what I mean, he's not a monster. I have heard that you have a son, that his name is Val and his tears. Oh, mister King has told me that he uh visit with you without Yeah at a playground.
00:28:39
Speaker 4: He told me.
00:28:41
Speaker 7: He told me how you were playing with Val and how the two of you were having fun. I'm glad that you spend time with your son and makes me so happy to hear about that, the.
00:28:54
Speaker 3: Two of you.
00:28:55
Speaker 4: That makes most m ms t.
00:28:58
Speaker 7: Mister King said that you are a very awful young man and then a dedicated father.
00:29:04
Speaker 4: So you work as a manager. That's good.
00:29:07
Speaker 7: Uh, I sure didn't keep us up. Spent a long time since I hear from anyone in my family. When Grandma passed a while back, and I wish you could have spent some time with your great grandma. She saw you back in eight oh, so she did get us. I was told that you would like to meet some of my family. That would be nice. Well soon I wanted to write and hope that this will help you to write me. Just you ask anything that you want. Well, I'm sorry it has taken so long to write, give my grandson to hug a bunch of kisses a day, and that its oh, you take care of yourself.
00:29:55
Speaker 4: Love that. Then he put happy for it for the life.
00:30:02
Speaker 7: I mean, obviously, you know we're past that age of for me being a kid and that and everything.
00:30:07
Speaker 4: But one thing that it makes me have is that connection.
00:30:11
Speaker 1: Feeling like a kid again. Watching Justin read this letter and take in Jeremy's words is complicated for me. This isn't some story about a long lost father reconnecting with his son through a genealogy website. This is different. This is heavy, and I'm always careful to keep expectations low. The father in this story is still locked inside the dead end of prison where he'll spend the rest of his life. But Justin seems to understand this. He's realistic and he wants to give his father a chance.
00:31:10
Speaker 7: Okay, So this was about four or five days ago, cause I started on it and I ain't gonna lie. I went started to the first sentence and then I stopped cause I didn't know what they're right, writer's block, Yeah, And then I wrote it again. So, dear Dad, even as I think of what to write down to start my letter off. I just keep thinking how this is the start of our relationship, which I think is awesome.
00:31:34
Speaker 1: I had Justin and Jeremy keep writing letters to each other. Jeremy mails me his for Justin and I either bring them to his house or take a picture and message them to him. To Justin, dear son, I got your letter, and I was glad you wrote. I really would like to get to know you a lot better. Tell me about you. How far did you go to school? Do you like sports? What kind of music do you like?
00:32:02
Speaker 3: Do Jeremy? Hey, dad?
00:32:05
Speaker 7: I spent majority of my life in Florida, and I want to say I'm book smart, but I'm definitely street smart. I'm talkative and quite at the same time. I pretty much learned to sit back and listen and only talk to learn. I like sports, anime, art, music.
00:32:21
Speaker 4: I like a lot of stuff.
00:32:22
Speaker 7: Well, my brain likes new stuff and I love challenges too. Mind games puzzles are a favorite.
00:32:28
Speaker 1: So tell me how tall are you. I'm about six feet and a half, got all my hair. I'm fifty four years old, same age as your mama. I don't know what all your mother has told you about me. I want to make sure that you understand I love your mom more than anything, and I always will if you talk with her, tell her. I said, hello, Okay, so how is your grandma doing. I'm sure that she told you about what me and your mom did. Took off with the car and then we were all over the state.
00:33:01
Speaker 7: I didn't know he took her car.
00:33:02
Speaker 1: Yeah, they went for some nig long road trip together. Boy was she mad?
00:33:06
Speaker 3: Boy was she mad?
00:33:07
Speaker 7: I bet she was.
00:33:09
Speaker 1: But I think if she was really mad, she would have called the cops faster, but she didn't. Once this communication has opened up, it revealed a side of Jeremy that I'd never truly seen in the four years we've been speaking Between them. There's an openness, almost a giddiness as they begin to learn about each other.
00:33:36
Speaker 7: To Jeremy, hey Dad, I got your letter from Gilbert and I was super excited. We're like pen pals in a way, except this father and his son.
00:33:44
Speaker 1: You were right, were like pen pals. I like that because I don't have many people to write me. I never knew who my father was. I always wanted to meet him, but I never did. I don't even know his name.
00:34:00
Speaker 3: Dear dad.
00:34:01
Speaker 7: I had a stepdad and some other father figures, but never got that father son bond, except with Henry and Todd. Henry was cool and married my grandma, but he died in the sleep. Todd was cool, and he taught me, my brother, Alie, and my sister how to defend ourselves. He had drug problems and got caught Robin Banks. He dated my mom for a bit.
00:34:26
Speaker 1: Dear Justin, I was looking at those pictures you sent of you and Vow. I couldn't stop myself from crying just seeing you with your son. It makes me so happy to see that the two of you together. I know Vow will be in good hands. Enjoy it while you can, because Vow will start growing, and before you know it, he will be a man with kids of his own. There's empathy and remorse, but there's also vulnerability. The raw knee Jeremy. He feels for family, for belonging. He takes pride in knowing his son has not followed the same path he did. He's trying on the role of a father, something he's never known, searching for ways to show love in a way he's never received. I hope one day that I will get to meet both of you, my son and grandson. So tell me about this family of yours.
00:35:30
Speaker 7: I have four kids now, but one of them is from my actual seat, but I love each one of them like they were my own. I've pretty much been winging life up until the point I had Bow, and then I started to learn about being responsible. Life could be amazing and scary as at times. Y'all can say Baul, Mama, Dad and Nana at the moment, and I get excited about the small things with thou.
00:35:58
Speaker 1: Sound like you are ready to walk down that road. She has three kids of her own. As long as you are happy and she is happy, that's all that matters. I'm sorry for not being there for you growing up. I'm glad that you are doing the right thing with your son.
00:36:16
Speaker 7: I'm not mad at you, by the way. I mean, I wish you would have thought before you acted, but we all make mistakes and we val and I appreciate the fact that you were at mad enough to still want to talk with me. I'm very proud of you too, and I'm super excited about you wanting to step forward and face your demons.
00:36:37
Speaker 1: Well son, maybe one day you can come to visit me that would be cool. Well, I hope to hear from you soon. I will close for now. I do love you, son. Don't you forget that.
00:36:50
Speaker 7: I'm standing beside you good, justin.
00:36:53
Speaker 1: Love, Dad, Jeremy.
00:37:10
Speaker 2: No, very early on you said learning all about this would actually help me be a better father. I'm just wondering if you still think about that.
00:37:16
Speaker 7: I think it has made me a better father, because I feel like it evolved from me worrying about me turning into him to me helping him find who he is.
00:37:26
Speaker 10: I don't hear you talking about wondering if you are your dad. I don't even think he's like himself. Now, how can I be like him if he's not like him? You know, you're not the scary Jeremy that everybody thought you was anymore. You're just you're messed up in the head.
00:37:43
Speaker 4: Jeremy.
00:37:44
Speaker 10: You know, and you need love.
00:37:48
Speaker 1: I asked Justin what does he hope to gain by learning his father's story and telling his own.
00:37:55
Speaker 7: I think it's more important to my family than anything else, because not just everybody's been through a lot. You know, it would just be nice for once in life a positive story. You know, if if I could have one positive story from a like a like a super bad situation, like no one in their right mind with everything Jeremy would do at one eighty like nobody. So what happens when you see him? You would want to know his story, right, You want to want to know what happened, what made him change, and to find out it was his heart. You know the hard work he put in, and you know the support team he has behind him, and everything else, it's just people gathering together and caring for one another.
00:38:58
Speaker 1: One of the things I told Justin is what Jeremy fears most. It's not a fear for his safety or his health in prison, but a fear about what will happen after he dies. The thought that haunts him most is being buried in the prison cemetery. And it turns out you'd have to have somebody that claim you, claim your body after your death. I don't want him buried.
00:39:22
Speaker 10: I don't care what state of mind he is or anything.
00:39:25
Speaker 7: I don't want him buried there.
00:39:27
Speaker 1: But he said he didn't think anybody in his immediate family, in putting his mother and his aunts would claim him.
00:39:33
Speaker 7: So he am I allowed to claim him. I think he would be then I'll claim him on that. I'm jumping right on that one, and if I can. Don't want it buried over here. I want him buried close to my other family. Just because someone does something bad doesn't mean they're not a family.
00:39:52
Speaker 9: You know.
00:39:53
Speaker 1: He might not be the father, but he's still my dad.
00:39:56
Speaker 7: But he's going to be buried like a human being.
00:40:00
Speaker 1: At least give him that for the fight he put in.
00:40:14
Speaker 4: Said you were better with talking than writing.
00:40:17
Speaker 1: Let's just do a quick thing here. I just talked to him and I'll write it down afterwards and send it.
00:40:21
Speaker 7: To him just like I act like I'm talking to him. Yeah, Okay, all right there, Jeremy. It's justin your son. I had Christmas and I owne.
00:40:32
Speaker 1: Valley is a production of Lava for Good podcast in association with Signal Company Number one.
00:40:39
Speaker 7: I just got your letter that you wrote to me from Gilbert today too, and it really sucks about not being able to visit yet. But we'll try to set up a thing to go visit soon enough and it will be a lot.
00:40:51
Speaker 1: Our executive producers are Jason Flom, Jeff Kepler, and Kevin Wurdis.
00:40:56
Speaker 7: But I did give permission to talk to you about my daughter. That's going to be. Yeah, I'm kind of starting mown tree kind of thing now. And you know they have a grandfather now to look up for, so you got to make sure you stay in line for them, keep your head.
00:41:12
Speaker 1: Caro Cornhaber is our senior producer. Jackie Pauley and Hannah bial are our producers.
00:41:17
Speaker 2: What do you think?
00:41:18
Speaker 3: What's your prediction for tomorrow?
00:41:19
Speaker 6: Jeremy Kansas City? All day, the history will be made.
00:41:25
Speaker 7: Hey, dad, Sorry for the late response, but Gilbert did really good and gave me your birthday letter rite on my birthday. It really brightened up my day and everything.
00:41:35
Speaker 1: I felt like a little.
00:41:36
Speaker 9: Kid, you know.
00:41:38
Speaker 1: Rit Spangler is our sound designer. Marianne mckuwne is our editor. Fact checking by Dania Suleiman.
00:41:45
Speaker 3: Sure, I got two more bikes, but I don't know if I'll ride them again or not. We'll see.
00:41:50
Speaker 6: It kind of takes your time, that's all. Yeah. Yeah, like putting tricycle wheels on her and just learning, you know.
00:42:00
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, that's a pretty good idea. All right, buddy, You take care of you.
00:42:05
Speaker 1: Jeff Clyburn is our head of Marketing and Operations, our social media director is is Maati Guardrama.
00:42:12
Speaker 7: And Gwinnevere was born.
00:42:14
Speaker 12: She's so beautiful.
00:42:16
Speaker 7: I'll eventually be able to send you.
00:42:17
Speaker 1: Pictures of Our social media manager is Sarah Gibbons and our art director is Andrew Nelson.
00:42:24
Speaker 7: Everything's been going good. I really do care about your dad, and I want to say happy birthday as well.
00:42:31
Speaker 5: I hope you get this before your birthday, but happy birthday, old man.
00:42:35
Speaker 4: I love you justin all right.
00:42:38
Speaker 6: Let Mary know I called you too, for she works.
00:42:40
Speaker 9: I will right now her.
00:42:43
Speaker 8: I said, everything that is good okay, and I'm goost sad her.
00:42:47
Speaker 6: I'm gonna send her a snapshot picture.
00:42:50
Speaker 1: Additional research and production by Kelsey Decker. Additional sound recording by James Johnson.
00:42:56
Speaker 12: He said they just had dinner and it was coas law, two pieces of bread and a rat patty. I said, what's a rat patty? And he said it's a Hamburger patty that has no real bone.
00:43:06
Speaker 1: Valley is written and produced by me Gilbert King. Follow us on Instagram, Facebook, TikTok, and threads at Lava for good.
00:43:15
Speaker 7: Stay good and stay on the right track, all right.
00:43:18
Speaker 3: I love you Dad.
00:43:20
Speaker 7: I don't know why I said bye.
00:43:24
Speaker 2: That was like a letter.
00:43:25
Speaker 4: Then you beat your head
