475. Is Your Podcast Too Conversational?

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Good morning podcasting Morning
Chat.

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Today is Tuesday, March 17th,
2026, and today it's our

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listener mailbag episode filled
with real world podcasting

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questions like whether
conversational can go too far

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and how to invest in gear
without overspending.

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So if you're listening live on
Clubhouse, hit the share button,

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bottom left hand side of the
screen and share it.

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However, Clubhouse lets you.
And if you're catching us via

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podcast, YouTube, LinkedIn,
etcetera, please share this

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episode with a fellow podcaster.
And now give us about 30 seconds

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and we'll get things rolling.
Thanks for being here.

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Good morning again, podcasting,
morning chat.

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Thank you so much for being
here.

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Happy Saint Patty's Day if that
is something you enjoy and

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celebrate.
Which means by the way we don't

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have Matt Bliss with us on
stage.

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I think he is observing Saint
Patty's Day today.

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But on stage with me currently
we have my Co host Sid Meadows,

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Ralphie Step, Dr. Faye, BC
Babbles, Alex Baelish and also

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Tide AKA Nikki has joined us
from the audience.

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A good morning to all of you and
a shout out to our first members

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of the Clubhouse audience, Mike
and Austin.

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Thank you for being here bright
and early this morning.

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Today, as I said, we're going to
be digging into the mailbag,

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have several interesting
questions to dump to dive, not

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dump into dive into.
And I want to first, before we

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do share with you what's coming
up The rest of this week,

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specifically Thursday, March
19th, we're dedicating the

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podcasting morning chat to
Podcast Thon.

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By the way, Podcast Don spelled
with one T.

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It's a global podcast movement
that encourages podcasters to

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use their platforms to highlight
a charity or a nonprofit that

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they care about.
I'd love for members of our

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community to join us live and
share an organization, a

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charity, or a 'cause that they
support along with why it

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matters to them, right?
Podcasting.

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We talked about the fact that
this is a storytelling platform,

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and I have a feeling that if you
have an organization you're

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picking, there is a story behind
that and I want to hear about

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it.
So join us live on Thursday,

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7:00 AM Eastern, and tell us
about a 'cause that means

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something to you.
What do they do?

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Why is their work important?
This is a chance for us to come

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together, spotlight
organizations doing meaningful

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work, and maybe introduce each
other to causes we might not

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have discovered otherwise.
And the charity I'm supporting

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is the CMTA, cmtausa.org, the
name of that disease that they

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are researching, refining money,
raising money to research.

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It's Charcot Marie Tooth
disease.

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It's a neurological disease that
kind of presents itself as a

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physical disability similarly to
muscular dystrophy in the sense

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that basically the the brain
signals don't properly send the

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right signals to the person's
extremities.

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So they're usually, it's their
most affected are their wrists,

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fingers, ankles, feet, toes,
hands, those areas.

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And it makes it really
challenging to walk because

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basically the signal doesn't get
there and then eventually the

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muscles start to weaken and
deteriorate because they're not

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able to be used, quote UN quote,
normally.

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Dr. Can I ask a question?
Go ahead, your friend.

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I'm sorry, I've forgotten his
name.

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Jonah.
OK, when did Jonah find out

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that?
When did he get diagnosed with

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it?
Good question, thank you for

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asking.
Actually, it is something you're

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born with and in many cases, not
all cases, 'cause sometimes this

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can just happens spontaneously,
but it is a genetic disease and

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it's passed on.
And there's a whole thing about

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how it's passed on that's really
kind of complex.

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But basically, let me the way I
can only explain it is using

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Jonah as an example.
So Jonah has CMT and he if he

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has female children, they're
guaranteed to have the disease

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and, and it's because of the
specific strand that he has.

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And then if he has a boy, the
boy does not have the disease

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and it has to do with being
carried in the female

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chromosome.
I believe so, yeah.

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So that's why or how it gets
passed.

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But again, that's just for his
specific strand of CMT.

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But there are.
Several.

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So it doesn't.
It's not one of those things

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that kind of lies dormant and
then all of a sudden, boom,

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you're showing us fine.
Yeah, that is a good question as

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well.
It doesn't generally or always

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show up instantaneously as far
as symptoms.

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And I think Jonas started
experiencing some sort of

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weakness symptoms.
He started experiencing them

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preteen to early teen years.
Yeah, so but you know, never,

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never the most, well, I should
just say kind of clumsy growing

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up, right?
Never really athletic because

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his there was just already, I
guess some signs, but nothing

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that you could really notice
other than maybe thinking he

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might be a little clumsy or not
good at sports.

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Quote UN quote.
But yeah, not until his teen

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years was it more noticeable.
And that's what actually ended

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up leading to the title of his
book.

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He walks like a cowboy because
he was visiting with a friend of

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his whose sister had never met
Jonah before.

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And apparently once he met them
and and left from that hang out,

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the sister asked, Hey, he walks
like a cowboy.

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Why does he walk like that?
And, and actually he loved it.

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He thought that that was
actually brilliant.

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Obviously that ended up being
the title of one of his books

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and he embraced that.
And that's one of the beautiful

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things about Jonah is he does
embrace his, this disease.

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He doesn't let it define him,
but he absolutely embraces it,

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understands it and takes it on
as a challenge in a really

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positive way.
And he's a huge inspiration to

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me.
And that's why I'm supporting

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that cause.
So that's a good thing to know

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because during podcast fawn,
it's hard to say without the a

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fawn on it.
So you can also have a CTA for

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him, for us, if we do like the,
you know, the what is it called?

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What's the disease, the CMT?
CMT.

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The call to action would be
something about buying his book,

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right?
Sure.

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That would be one way you could
support.

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I mean that would support him
specifically.

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But if you want to support, and
I will share this on Thursday as

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well, but since we're talking
about it, if you want to support

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the CMTA for research, go to
CMTAUSA dot org.

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Make sure you include the USA so
cmtausa.org and you can hit that

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donate button at the top right
hand side and donate any amount

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because any amount would be a
huge support of the

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organization.
So thank you in advance for

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that.
More to come on that.

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I am going to try to get Jonah
to at least stop in on Thursday

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to share a little bit more about
it.

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Otherwise, if not I'm we're
going to be recording a little

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something as well so I can help
promote and share this awesome

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organization that I also
volunteer at their summer camp

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this year.
I'll be doing it twice this

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year.
So more on that.

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Also quickly, a meet up is
coming to the Washington, DC

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area hosted by yours truly and
my friend Christina.

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We are doing this on Thursday,
March 26th at 5:30 PM Eastern at

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a place called Pinstripes in
North Bethesda, MD.

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We'll give you a link in the
show notes if you want to learn

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more about it, but you can go to
Podcasting Morning Chat.

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Uh oh, I think I've forgotten
Podcasting Morning chat.com/EPC

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March, EPC March, and you can
get those details there.

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I will be there along with a lot
of other community members from

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the Empowered Podcasting
Conference.

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So come checked out that we
would love to see you there in

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person.
And actually Tide, are you

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thinking about making it?
Let's see if she can come.

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Up.
I really hope I can.

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Come up there she tide some in
the morning sometimes is very

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busy, so she'll just pop on real
quick and say something and then

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pop right back off good.
I hope you can make it tide.

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I would love to meet you there
in person.

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All right, so let's dig in to
the mailbag.

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And of course, I got to pull out
the mailbag.

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Grab a piece of mail here.
All right, this one comes from

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long time community member
Simona Costantini.

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You may have heard me tease this
one last week.

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We didn't get to it.
Simona asks, is there such a

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thing as a podcast that is too
conversational?

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For example, no structure at all
to the conversation, no

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direction, guest and host are
just going off on tangents,

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etcetera.
People say they want a

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conversational podcast, but what
does that really mean?

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And is there a way to do it
that's more effective?

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Let's we'll dig into this.
I want to hear from more people.

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And yes, I see several of you
want to chime in.

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I personally do think a podcast
can be too conversational.

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I think a lot of people say they
want a conversational podcast

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when what they really mean is
they want something that's

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natural, that's relaxed, that's
human.

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But to me, natural doesn't mean
winging it in these days in an

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organic conversation.
I'm wondering, is it overdone at

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this point when we say that?
In other words, is it just me

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who feels like there's a common
explanation A podcaster gives

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when they explain their show?
Oh, it's, it's just like a

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conversation that you're sitting
in on, eavesdropping on the

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conversation.
How many times have you heard

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that when you ask somebody what
their podcast is about?

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I think the best conversational
podcast still have direction,

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even if the structure is subtle.
So when you hear someone say

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they want their podcast to feel
conversational, what do you

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think they mean?
And is there really such a

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thing?
I'm going to go to Nikki first,

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our guest from the audience, and
then I'll check in with BC.

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Go ahead, Nikki, good morning.
Or Tide, whatever you prefer.

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It's two.
No, you're totally fine.

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You can call me Nikki, that's
perfectly fine.

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So for me, when I think of
conversational, I typically lean

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towards interview style like the
Q&A.

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That's the first thing for me
that comes up because most of

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the podcasts that I have been on
as a guest have not really been

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natural in that sense.
I've never been on a podcast

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where we're just shooting the
breeze talking about things and

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it's very, it's felt very
relaxed.

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Every podcast has always had
some sense of formality to it

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where it was more just AQ and A
and there may be some brief

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commentary in between, but very
little.

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Now, I adopted that same type of
mentality for my podcast, but I

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just recently realized, like, as
of, you know, 48 hours ago that

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I needed my podcast if I was
really going to step up my game

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and have it be a podcast that
could hang in the big league, so

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to speak.
You know, with all of you guys

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and, and the people who you talk
about, I was like, I really have

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to step up my game.
And I wasn't 100% sure how to do

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that.
But then I realized, you know

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what, it's my voice, it's my own
commentary.

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It's my analysis that pulls the
whole podcast together, not the

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fact that I can bring on and
attract good guests and have it

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be informational.
That's not what's going to take

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my podcast to the next level and
having these sort of formal

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conversations.
What's going to take my podcast

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to the next level is bringing
the guests on and attracting

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those people, but also making
sure that there's a balance

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between the information that
they're offering and the culture

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that people are constantly
living in and thinking about

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South.
Yesterday, I filmed my first

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podcast where I adopted that
mentality entirely.

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And I said, you know what, I'm
going to interview this guy

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where I'm going to ask him
questions.

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But the conversation is going to
be focused primarily on the

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culture that parents are living
every day.

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And the example to that was
instead of just interviewing the

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guy and asking him questions
about his life and the way he

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raised his child, now the
conversation was centered around

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modern day parenting
philosophies around like low

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expectations and the current
educational system and the

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expectation that some parents
have that they have to wait for

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someone or something like an
institution to step in and help

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00:13:59,440 --> 00:14:01,520
their child when there's a
problem, etcetera.

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00:14:01,800 --> 00:14:06,520
And so that shift in the
conversational style really

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elevated the the podcast, I
think.

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And I'm looking forward to
feedback on that on that

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episode, because as soon as I
post it, I'm going to ask for

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direct feedback.
Awesome.

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00:14:15,280 --> 00:14:18,320
We could do an evaluation
episode if you want, Nikki,

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00:14:18,440 --> 00:14:20,920
happy to do that for you with
that episode.

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And thank you for your insights.
I, I something that really

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struck me that I wrote down, as
you said it was that you're

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looking to find that balance of
structure and culture.

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I think that's what you said.
If it's not, please forgive me.

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00:14:34,720 --> 00:14:38,240
And I think even taking that a
step further or adding on to

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00:14:38,240 --> 00:14:42,520
culture is really that idea of
storytelling, right?

241
00:14:42,520 --> 00:14:47,160
Because the culture often times
harvests a lot of interesting

242
00:14:47,160 --> 00:14:50,160
stories.
And I think again, as we've, as

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00:14:50,160 --> 00:14:52,840
I mentioned earlier and I, we
mentioned before that

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00:14:52,840 --> 00:14:56,200
storytelling is really, in my
opinion, the heart of what makes

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00:14:56,240 --> 00:15:01,880
a podcast so listenable.
Or maybe not if you're not doing

246
00:15:02,200 --> 00:15:04,600
any storytelling.
But yeah, I think that it's

247
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creating some structure so that
there's you can so that you can

248
00:15:08,920 --> 00:15:13,320
navigate the conversation, but
then allowing for that room,

249
00:15:13,440 --> 00:15:16,840
that breathing room, that
storytelling, so that and and

250
00:15:16,840 --> 00:15:18,720
allow the storytelling to
happen, right?

251
00:15:18,720 --> 00:15:21,400
Not just force it, but allow it
to happen.

252
00:15:21,600 --> 00:15:24,920
Sit back and in and enjoy and
ask more questions about the

253
00:15:24,920 --> 00:15:28,280
story, etcetera.
That's what keeps people engaged

254
00:15:28,280 --> 00:15:32,960
and listening.
I see that here Mike Short puts

255
00:15:32,960 --> 00:15:35,440
in the chat.
Really depends on the host and

256
00:15:35,440 --> 00:15:38,520
his or her ability to lead a
conversation and be able to

257
00:15:38,520 --> 00:15:41,840
change directions based on how
the conversation goes.

258
00:15:42,240 --> 00:15:47,360
Style of podcast, skill of host
and format all play a role and

259
00:15:47,360 --> 00:15:51,320
it can it be too conversational?
Probably for most people yes,

260
00:15:51,320 --> 00:15:56,080
but not for everyone.
Valid points there, Mike.

261
00:15:56,120 --> 00:15:59,120
I appreciate that.
All right, I see lots of people

262
00:15:59,120 --> 00:16:01,600
want to chime in.
I'm going to go to BC 1st and

263
00:16:01,600 --> 00:16:03,400
then I'm going to check in with
Sid.

264
00:16:03,400 --> 00:16:06,760
Yeah.
I think the the goal to be Uber

265
00:16:06,760 --> 00:16:09,120
conversational is one of the
many reasons I call my show

266
00:16:09,120 --> 00:16:12,480
casual Babble because I know
we're not going to stick to any

267
00:16:12,480 --> 00:16:15,800
strict script.
And often when I send my

268
00:16:16,200 --> 00:16:20,080
interviewee a prep sheet, I have
only a list of topics, but I

269
00:16:20,080 --> 00:16:23,760
tell them in the prep sheet,
this is not a verbatim script.

270
00:16:24,080 --> 00:16:27,120
These are things I want to try
to make sure we hit on the

271
00:16:27,120 --> 00:16:30,280
conversation.
We will pivot, we will have

272
00:16:30,280 --> 00:16:32,800
little nuance tangents here and
there.

273
00:16:33,520 --> 00:16:34,800
But that's part of the beauty of
it.

274
00:16:35,320 --> 00:16:38,080
And even though I don't
explicitly say this, I know I

275
00:16:38,080 --> 00:16:42,120
want my show to eventually,
ultimately come across as well.

276
00:16:42,120 --> 00:16:44,680
What happens if you do walk into
a room and you're listening to

277
00:16:44,680 --> 00:16:48,840
two thought leaders discuss
something happening in today's

278
00:16:48,840 --> 00:16:53,680
business world that is catered
to the young entrepreneur?

279
00:16:54,000 --> 00:16:56,800
And what happens if you just
choose to sit down at the table

280
00:16:56,800 --> 00:16:59,640
and listen to them discuss
whatever the topic is?

281
00:17:00,040 --> 00:17:05,240
And for me, this just goes back
to us discussing, you know,

282
00:17:05,920 --> 00:17:09,920
listening intently to somebody
because if you've really do

283
00:17:09,920 --> 00:17:13,720
that, and if you listen to those
moments where they touch on

284
00:17:13,720 --> 00:17:18,520
something in a response to an
earlier question and you take

285
00:17:18,520 --> 00:17:23,920
that opportunity to open up sub
questions and, and nice, great

286
00:17:23,920 --> 00:17:28,040
little pivot points to really
explore the nuances of any given

287
00:17:28,079 --> 00:17:31,800
subtopic of a of an episode or,
or a recording session.

288
00:17:32,160 --> 00:17:37,120
And it really opens up a lot of
great new insights that you may

289
00:17:37,120 --> 00:17:41,720
not have planned for.
And if you do it well enough, I

290
00:17:41,720 --> 00:17:44,360
think there's really an arch you
can develop into it where you

291
00:17:44,360 --> 00:17:48,080
can find a flow with yourself
that you can kind of pull

292
00:17:48,080 --> 00:17:51,800
someone into that way.
It doesn't seem too interview

293
00:17:51,800 --> 00:17:53,560
style.
It seems super casual.

294
00:17:53,560 --> 00:17:57,600
It seems super flow based.
So it can come across ultimately

295
00:17:57,600 --> 00:18:02,160
as very casual, but still having
a focus and an overall goal.

296
00:18:03,400 --> 00:18:06,240
And I knew I had one other
little caveat I wanted to

297
00:18:06,240 --> 00:18:08,720
mention.
I'm going to lose it now.

298
00:18:08,960 --> 00:18:12,600
So I'm going to give my time
back because I'm pretty sure I'm

299
00:18:12,600 --> 00:18:15,640
not going to recall it in a
timely fashion.

300
00:18:15,640 --> 00:18:17,680
So I'm going to give it back.
Installing technique.

301
00:18:18,360 --> 00:18:23,080
Give it back.
Thank you, VC, appreciate it and

302
00:18:23,080 --> 00:18:25,640
totally relatable.
I know you've heard me do that

303
00:18:25,640 --> 00:18:29,200
many a time here on this show
for getting one of the points I

304
00:18:29,200 --> 00:18:32,560
want to make and even writing it
down sometimes doesn't do me any

305
00:18:32,560 --> 00:18:34,720
justice as well.
But thank you, Fairpoint.

306
00:18:34,920 --> 00:18:37,560
I'm with you there.
I want to keep it moving because

307
00:18:37,560 --> 00:18:39,600
there are lots of people that
want to chime in.

308
00:18:39,800 --> 00:18:43,120
I'm going to go to Sid Ralph and
I think Alex wants to chime in

309
00:18:43,120 --> 00:18:44,520
as well.
Go for it, Sid.

310
00:18:44,520 --> 00:18:45,800
Good morning.
Yeah.

311
00:18:45,840 --> 00:18:48,720
Good morning, everybody.
Great question, Simona.

312
00:18:50,440 --> 00:18:55,280
I have this type of podcast and
I have an intention of what the

313
00:18:55,280 --> 00:18:59,680
topic is going to be about.
And I do have a run of show

314
00:18:59,680 --> 00:19:02,280
document that most of the time I
really don't follow.

315
00:19:02,280 --> 00:19:06,000
I look at it occasionally, but
I'd have the idea of the topics

316
00:19:06,000 --> 00:19:08,320
I want to talk about.
But what I tell, my guess is

317
00:19:08,320 --> 00:19:11,200
it's literally just we're just
talking shop.

318
00:19:11,200 --> 00:19:12,640
We're just like having a
conversation.

319
00:19:13,080 --> 00:19:15,240
And I do that specifically
because I don't want them to get

320
00:19:15,240 --> 00:19:18,120
stressed out about, oh, I'm
behind a mic and I'm on camera

321
00:19:18,120 --> 00:19:20,800
and you know, blah, blah, blah.
Because most of my guests have

322
00:19:20,800 --> 00:19:24,280
never been on podcasts before.
But you know, my goal is to

323
00:19:24,280 --> 00:19:27,440
just, it is literally just a
conversation.

324
00:19:27,920 --> 00:19:30,600
Again, I have an intention and a
direction I want to take it.

325
00:19:30,600 --> 00:19:34,080
But sometimes it doesn't go
there because if you're doing

326
00:19:34,080 --> 00:19:37,560
your job as a host listening,
the guest is going to say

327
00:19:37,560 --> 00:19:40,240
something that's riddled with
gold and you're going to be able

328
00:19:40,240 --> 00:19:43,200
to take the conversation
somewhere else or go deeper or

329
00:19:43,200 --> 00:19:46,960
get more Nuggets out of them.
So, but you know, I like the

330
00:19:46,960 --> 00:19:49,520
informalness of just having a
conversation.

331
00:19:49,960 --> 00:19:53,760
Now, on the flip side, I watched
a show the other day that a

332
00:19:53,760 --> 00:19:56,240
friend of mine was on.
It was a music show, which is

333
00:19:56,240 --> 00:19:57,840
not something that I typically
watch.

334
00:19:59,000 --> 00:20:01,400
And it was a YouTube first show,
which is also something that I

335
00:20:01,400 --> 00:20:06,120
don't typically do.
Anyways, it was awful.

336
00:20:07,160 --> 00:20:11,760
It was like these two guys just
literally rambling.

337
00:20:12,720 --> 00:20:14,800
And I thought to myself, what's
the purpose of the show?

338
00:20:14,800 --> 00:20:18,240
What are they trying to do?
Where are they trying to go and

339
00:20:18,240 --> 00:20:21,080
what are they trying to do?
And then they talk about a song

340
00:20:21,480 --> 00:20:23,720
and they play a they play a clip
and then they have this.

341
00:20:23,720 --> 00:20:26,560
My friend came in and talked
about his view of the song

342
00:20:26,560 --> 00:20:28,960
because he listened to the song.
So that was the intent.

343
00:20:28,960 --> 00:20:32,080
But between those little
segments, it was just like

344
00:20:32,080 --> 00:20:35,160
straight up rambling.
So you can have a conversational

345
00:20:35,160 --> 00:20:40,960
podcast and it be not really
serve much purpose and have very

346
00:20:40,960 --> 00:20:42,640
little intention.
Thank you.

347
00:20:42,640 --> 00:20:44,640
Sid, I have a follow up question
for you.

348
00:20:45,240 --> 00:20:48,840
If that's the case, what are the
signs that a podcast

349
00:20:48,840 --> 00:20:51,840
conversation has lost its
direction?

350
00:20:51,960 --> 00:20:54,040
You know, you just said you
listen to the show and it was

351
00:20:54,040 --> 00:20:58,520
awful and it sounded like there
was no real direction of that

352
00:20:58,520 --> 00:21:00,360
show.
So what are those signs for

353
00:21:00,360 --> 00:21:02,880
podcasters who may not really
realize it?

354
00:21:03,280 --> 00:21:06,920
What are those signs of that
they've lost direction on during

355
00:21:06,920 --> 00:21:09,440
that conversation?
That's a really good question

356
00:21:09,440 --> 00:21:12,280
mark.
And I think that my, my initial

357
00:21:12,280 --> 00:21:15,840
response to that is if you're
just rambling, like if you're

358
00:21:15,840 --> 00:21:18,760
just rambling and you, you
brought somebody in to talk

359
00:21:18,760 --> 00:21:21,200
about podcasting and all of a
sudden you're talking about your

360
00:21:21,200 --> 00:21:25,160
favorite sports team, right?
If you're just rambling or if

361
00:21:25,160 --> 00:21:29,920
the conversation goes too far
off track from what you were

362
00:21:29,920 --> 00:21:32,320
supposed to be talking about, I
think those are some signs.

363
00:21:32,600 --> 00:21:37,080
And also, I think a really good
sign here is how is your guest

364
00:21:37,080 --> 00:21:41,720
engaging with you?
Like, are they responding back

365
00:21:41,720 --> 00:21:44,840
to you or they kind of sitting
quietly listening to you ramble?

366
00:21:44,840 --> 00:21:47,440
I mean, watch the body language
and the facial expressions of

367
00:21:47,440 --> 00:21:49,200
your guest.
That could also give you some

368
00:21:49,200 --> 00:21:50,240
clues.
I hope that answered your

369
00:21:50,240 --> 00:21:51,960
question.
Yeah, I think it does.

370
00:21:52,080 --> 00:21:53,640
Yeah.
Dr. did you want to add on to

371
00:21:53,640 --> 00:21:55,040
that?
I know I'm skipping the line

372
00:21:55,040 --> 00:21:58,760
most.
People are saying that yes, it

373
00:21:58,760 --> 00:22:05,320
can be too conversational.
I used to edit a show where the

374
00:22:05,320 --> 00:22:10,280
host decided to interview his
best friend.

375
00:22:11,000 --> 00:22:17,960
And I'm going to caution people
to keep a sharp eye on on the

376
00:22:17,960 --> 00:22:22,880
conversation because it can very
definitely veer off into

377
00:22:23,800 --> 00:22:27,640
forgetting that you're on the
mic and just having just the two

378
00:22:27,640 --> 00:22:30,120
of you talk.
And no one knows what the hell

379
00:22:30,120 --> 00:22:32,240
you're talking about except for
the two of you.

380
00:22:32,600 --> 00:22:35,400
So it was, hey, you know, I love
Tony.

381
00:22:35,400 --> 00:22:36,880
Oh, yeah.
I went to temple with Tony.

382
00:22:36,880 --> 00:22:38,000
Oh, did you go to temple with
Tony?

383
00:22:38,000 --> 00:22:39,600
Oh, you know what we're talking
about for Tony's.

384
00:22:39,840 --> 00:22:43,680
No, I went to temple with Tony.
I mean, it was just so nothing.

385
00:22:45,240 --> 00:22:47,800
And they completely forgot that
they were on the mic.

386
00:22:48,160 --> 00:22:52,560
So yeah, I did a lot of content
editing on that show.

387
00:22:52,720 --> 00:22:55,600
Yeah, that was exactly what was
just popping through my head.

388
00:22:55,600 --> 00:22:58,840
Is, is that's when you're
creating good, bad, or

389
00:22:58,840 --> 00:23:01,080
indifferent, you're creating
potentially more work for

390
00:23:01,080 --> 00:23:03,520
yourself because you got to do
more content editing.

391
00:23:03,520 --> 00:23:06,880
You got to find those moments
after the fact, which again, I'm

392
00:23:06,880 --> 00:23:10,200
not judging and saying whether
it's good or bad because in some

393
00:23:10,200 --> 00:23:12,640
ways that could be to your
advantage, right?

394
00:23:12,640 --> 00:23:16,480
Is to allow the conversation to
go wherever it wants to go, as

395
00:23:16,480 --> 00:23:21,960
long as you have time or the
resources to edit some of that

396
00:23:21,960 --> 00:23:25,160
conversation out so that you're
keeping it entertaining and

397
00:23:25,160 --> 00:23:27,560
interesting for your audience.
Right.

398
00:23:27,560 --> 00:23:30,520
And Sid had mentioned something
about rambling.

399
00:23:30,960 --> 00:23:34,960
You know, when you're in the
middle of a ramble, sometimes

400
00:23:35,080 --> 00:23:40,040
it's hard to catch yourself.
Like if you're on a roll, you

401
00:23:40,040 --> 00:23:43,600
know, occasionally you'll stop
and take a breath and go, OK,

402
00:23:43,600 --> 00:23:47,280
I'm rambling.
But for the most part, a lot of

403
00:23:47,280 --> 00:23:49,880
people will not be able to catch
themselves.

404
00:23:49,880 --> 00:23:52,000
They're like on a soapbox, you
know?

405
00:23:52,160 --> 00:23:54,000
Yeah, yeah.
Especially the guests, I think

406
00:23:54,000 --> 00:23:58,200
that guests who more times than
not, they aren't really trained

407
00:23:58,200 --> 00:24:00,720
to do this.
They don't have the repetitions

408
00:24:01,040 --> 00:24:03,200
to recognize when that's
happening.

409
00:24:03,200 --> 00:24:05,760
And I think, again, that's a
sign of a good host to be able

410
00:24:05,760 --> 00:24:09,080
to catch that and redirect the
conversation accordingly.

411
00:24:09,240 --> 00:24:10,120
Exactly.
Yeah.

412
00:24:10,400 --> 00:24:13,280
Thank you.
Dr. BC, Did you want to share

413
00:24:13,280 --> 00:24:15,160
the point that you just
remembered?

414
00:24:15,160 --> 00:24:19,600
Yes, so I do sometimes have to
let my guests know and even I do

415
00:24:19,600 --> 00:24:23,840
this in like job interviews too
that when I listen intently and

416
00:24:23,840 --> 00:24:27,680
maybe others may be able to feel
this too.

417
00:24:28,000 --> 00:24:31,880
I have a tendency to have
resting bitch face so and that

418
00:24:31,880 --> 00:24:34,600
can sometimes cause an
interviewee to be discouraged.

419
00:24:34,600 --> 00:24:36,840
Like I don't care about what
they're talking about, but I

420
00:24:36,840 --> 00:24:40,680
have to let them know I do care.
And when I listen intently, I

421
00:24:40,680 --> 00:24:42,800
don't control how my face
responds.

422
00:24:42,800 --> 00:24:46,280
I just let it kind of droop into
this RBF state, but I'm

423
00:24:46,280 --> 00:24:48,360
listening so I know how to
respond.

424
00:24:49,480 --> 00:24:52,360
Maybe other people people out
there have similar caveats to

425
00:24:52,360 --> 00:24:55,840
their approach and interviewing,
but I do have that particular

426
00:24:55,840 --> 00:24:59,600
element I do have to clarify
prior to most interviews.

427
00:25:00,160 --> 00:25:04,040
Fair enough, I've definitely
witnessed the RBF before from

428
00:25:04,040 --> 00:25:04,920
BC.
You're welcome.

429
00:25:05,880 --> 00:25:08,880
I've seen it there and wondered
if he was happy or you know,

430
00:25:08,880 --> 00:25:10,800
just didn't want to be here
sometimes.

431
00:25:11,120 --> 00:25:14,120
But but ever since he's called
that out, that's this not being

432
00:25:14,120 --> 00:25:17,560
the first time I've known.
It's just B CS face, that's all.

433
00:25:17,600 --> 00:25:21,360
He just has that look when he's
not I guess when he's just not

434
00:25:21,360 --> 00:25:24,920
engaged in the actual
conversation, meaning speaking

435
00:25:25,000 --> 00:25:27,720
in the conversation.
That resting bitch face

436
00:25:27,720 --> 00:25:29,720
definitely comes out.
I've seen it, yes.

437
00:25:31,240 --> 00:25:33,160
Ralph, did you want to add
something to all this?

438
00:25:33,640 --> 00:25:34,880
I did.
I have a little bit of a

439
00:25:34,880 --> 00:25:38,640
different approach to this and I
think the key conversation we

440
00:25:38,640 --> 00:25:40,280
should be having is with our
audience.

441
00:25:40,680 --> 00:25:43,240
And I think if you want to be
really effective content

442
00:25:43,240 --> 00:25:45,480
creator, you should be engaging
your audience.

443
00:25:46,080 --> 00:25:49,240
When I'm listening to a show and
I'm talking back to the show,

444
00:25:49,560 --> 00:25:53,000
when I'm feeling like I need to
comment on the show, I think

445
00:25:53,000 --> 00:25:54,120
that and it's not what we're
talking.

446
00:25:54,120 --> 00:25:56,840
It's a little bit of a different
take, But I, I feel like that's

447
00:25:56,840 --> 00:25:58,840
the conversation we should be
focusing in on.

448
00:25:59,120 --> 00:26:01,040
And if you have two people,
you're doing a guest show.

449
00:26:01,280 --> 00:26:03,640
I'm the third party in the room.
I, oh, I got to get this in.

450
00:26:03,640 --> 00:26:06,920
I want to say this, I think that
one of the places where I see

451
00:26:06,920 --> 00:26:10,840
this done exceptionally well is
on the podcast or the pod News

452
00:26:10,840 --> 00:26:13,320
Weekly Review.
Sam and James do this.

453
00:26:13,440 --> 00:26:15,640
They do it throughout the show,
but then they have a part at the

454
00:26:15,640 --> 00:26:17,640
end where they go back and talk
about what's going on with you,

455
00:26:17,640 --> 00:26:19,160
James, what's going on with you,
Sam.

456
00:26:19,160 --> 00:26:20,640
So I think there's a place for
it.

457
00:26:21,160 --> 00:26:23,400
The third thing I want to say is
the money guy on the show.

458
00:26:23,720 --> 00:26:28,240
This is a great opportunity to
build in some affiliate, build

459
00:26:28,240 --> 00:26:33,000
in some ideas of way to build
some support for your podcast by

460
00:26:33,000 --> 00:26:35,080
saying, you know what?
I if you're feeling the same way

461
00:26:35,080 --> 00:26:38,000
I'm feeling, if you, you know,
this is a place where you can

462
00:26:38,000 --> 00:26:40,920
demonstrate some value that you
can bring to them.

463
00:26:40,920 --> 00:26:42,520
So I just don't want to miss
sight notes because the

464
00:26:42,520 --> 00:26:46,120
conversational part is a great
segue into, hey, if you're

465
00:26:46,120 --> 00:26:48,920
feeling this way, I work with
such and such, or I have this

466
00:26:48,920 --> 00:26:51,320
product or I have this person
that I could recommend.

467
00:26:51,320 --> 00:26:53,520
So I think there's a lot of
Simone, I think there's a lot of

468
00:26:53,520 --> 00:26:56,120
value in the conversation.
I just think it has to be

469
00:26:56,120 --> 00:26:57,560
structured.
I was listening to 1:00 this

470
00:26:57,560 --> 00:27:01,360
morning, actually appeared on
somebody's show and they totally

471
00:27:01,360 --> 00:27:04,000
changed the structure of the
show and they put this huge

472
00:27:04,000 --> 00:27:06,400
conversation at the front.
I was like, that's terrible.

473
00:27:06,760 --> 00:27:09,960
I want to give them value first.
I think there's a place for

474
00:27:09,960 --> 00:27:13,200
conversation later, but I think
you've got to give your listener

475
00:27:13,200 --> 00:27:15,480
value at the front end.
So thank you for letting me pipe

476
00:27:15,480 --> 00:27:17,400
in with that Mark.
Yeah, you're welcome.

477
00:27:17,400 --> 00:27:19,840
And by the way, I should say,
because you you said Simona's

478
00:27:19,840 --> 00:27:22,320
name and that triggered
something in my mind, I should

479
00:27:22,320 --> 00:27:25,080
say that I think it's safe to
assume that Simona has a very

480
00:27:25,080 --> 00:27:28,040
strong opinion of this.
And I'm guessing that that

481
00:27:28,040 --> 00:27:31,600
opinion is, is that she believes
podcast can get too

482
00:27:31,600 --> 00:27:35,480
conversational and lose its
focus as an inexperienced

483
00:27:35,480 --> 00:27:38,880
podcast producer, I know that
she must have an opinion on

484
00:27:38,880 --> 00:27:40,520
that.
I think she was asking because

485
00:27:40,520 --> 00:27:43,800
she was just curious what the
community feels about that

486
00:27:44,000 --> 00:27:46,400
question.
So just, yeah, adding that

487
00:27:46,400 --> 00:27:49,040
little asterisk there.
And yeah, Ralph, I mean, this

488
00:27:49,040 --> 00:27:52,040
all goes back to, again,
something that we just mentioned

489
00:27:52,040 --> 00:27:55,920
a moment ago that I think that
this mostly comes back to the

490
00:27:55,920 --> 00:27:58,560
host.
It's the host's responsibility

491
00:27:58,640 --> 00:28:03,360
to have that quote UN quote,
great conversation because in my

492
00:28:03,360 --> 00:28:06,520
opinion, a great conversation
can sound loose and natural.

493
00:28:06,520 --> 00:28:10,600
It can sound conversational, but
the host is still guiding it

494
00:28:10,760 --> 00:28:13,520
behind the scenes.
You know, I, I know Sid, I've

495
00:28:13,520 --> 00:28:18,640
heard Sid do this before, right.
Sid does allow to, to allow the

496
00:28:18,640 --> 00:28:22,240
guest to be conversational.
It, he allows the conversation

497
00:28:22,240 --> 00:28:26,640
to go in potentially different
directions, but I've also seen

498
00:28:26,640 --> 00:28:29,960
him guide it back to the
direction he wants it to go.

499
00:28:31,000 --> 00:28:34,360
I think there is a skill to that
and I think it, it's it can come

500
00:28:34,360 --> 00:28:38,120
with practice.
By the way, good morning to

501
00:28:38,120 --> 00:28:39,800
Jonathan Howard, who's joined
us.

502
00:28:39,800 --> 00:28:43,560
And I just want to shout him out
again and say great episode

503
00:28:43,560 --> 00:28:46,160
yesterday, the Obsession Worthy
podcast episode.

504
00:28:46,440 --> 00:28:50,040
Thoroughly enjoyed that one.
And you can go back and listen

505
00:28:50,040 --> 00:28:56,160
to that one at Podcasting
Morning chat.com/O WP.

506
00:28:56,680 --> 00:28:59,520
That is the those are the
correct initials that I continue

507
00:28:59,520 --> 00:29:03,680
to get wrong and even flustered
Jonathan yesterday in the

508
00:29:03,680 --> 00:29:06,680
process.
Anyway, So going back to it

509
00:29:06,680 --> 00:29:11,720
here, what can a host do?
I mean, Ralph gave some some

510
00:29:11,720 --> 00:29:15,520
ideas here or an idea here, but
what can a host do to keep a

511
00:29:15,520 --> 00:29:19,080
conversation natural while still
giving it shape?

512
00:29:19,440 --> 00:29:22,680
Any thoughts on that?
How do we as hosts keep it

513
00:29:22,680 --> 00:29:27,360
sounding natural, feeling like a
conversation, but still shaping

514
00:29:27,360 --> 00:29:31,280
it the entire duration, or at
least a duration?

515
00:29:31,280 --> 00:29:33,560
Alex, good morning.
Go for it.

516
00:29:34,360 --> 00:29:40,320
Hey, when it comes to get and
hosting, it's to me it's about

517
00:29:40,320 --> 00:29:48,240
rapport and trying to find out
what makes that guest tick, what

518
00:29:48,240 --> 00:29:51,640
they're interested in and that
if you can put the guests at

519
00:29:51,640 --> 00:29:54,200
ease.
You know, Sid was saying a lot

520
00:29:54,200 --> 00:29:58,160
of the people that he talks to
are first time podcasters And

521
00:29:58,840 --> 00:30:03,160
you know, once you start, I
mean, I do this in my own non

522
00:30:03,160 --> 00:30:05,960
podcasting life in terms of my
job.

523
00:30:06,160 --> 00:30:09,760
You know, you have people that
are scared to do CPR, they're

524
00:30:09,760 --> 00:30:14,600
scared to work on mannequins.
You find out what they love, why

525
00:30:14,600 --> 00:30:18,720
they're there, and work from
there and chip away at it so

526
00:30:18,720 --> 00:30:21,920
that they can get to you can get
to the layers that make them

527
00:30:21,920 --> 00:30:24,480
comfortable.
Hopefully it's not too

528
00:30:24,480 --> 00:30:29,560
comfortable like we just talked
about, But and then once you

529
00:30:29,560 --> 00:30:34,240
find out what makes them tick as
a host, you can kind of pull on

530
00:30:34,240 --> 00:30:37,640
those strings, so to speak, and
get the best out of them.

531
00:30:38,080 --> 00:30:39,920
And I think that that's what
it's about it.

532
00:30:39,920 --> 00:30:42,200
It's really about getting the
best out of them.

533
00:30:42,320 --> 00:30:45,120
So I know Todd had something.
Yeah, that's awesome.

534
00:30:45,120 --> 00:30:49,040
I appreciate that response.
Yeah, I think it is the host's

535
00:30:49,040 --> 00:30:51,600
responsibility to develop a
little chemistry, a little

536
00:30:51,600 --> 00:30:53,920
rapport with their guest.
And that's why we're not going

537
00:30:53,920 --> 00:30:56,800
to go into it today because I
feel like lately we've been

538
00:30:56,800 --> 00:31:00,640
going at it at nauseam.
But that is why I personally

539
00:31:00,720 --> 00:31:05,560
prefer having a pre interview,
even just just getting face to

540
00:31:05,560 --> 00:31:09,600
face with people, having a few
minutes prior to the show, the

541
00:31:09,600 --> 00:31:13,480
day, days before the show.
It there's just something that

542
00:31:13,480 --> 00:31:17,120
it creates for you and your
guest that next time you sit

543
00:31:17,120 --> 00:31:21,240
down, there's a little less
awkwardness or discomfort

544
00:31:21,760 --> 00:31:24,880
because you've gotten that
initial meeting out of the way

545
00:31:24,880 --> 00:31:26,600
and you feel a little more
loose.

546
00:31:26,600 --> 00:31:29,840
In most cases, not all cases.
But I like I said, I don't want

547
00:31:29,840 --> 00:31:31,440
to dig too far into it.
Go ahead, Tide.

548
00:31:32,120 --> 00:31:34,480
Sure.
Yes, For me, in terms of shaping

549
00:31:34,480 --> 00:31:38,520
the episode, I think that one
important piece is to challenge

550
00:31:38,520 --> 00:31:43,960
any assumptions that people
might be making about the topic

551
00:31:43,960 --> 00:31:45,680
at hand.
So having a conversation with

552
00:31:45,680 --> 00:31:49,280
someone, I can usually pick out
what the assumptions that the

553
00:31:49,280 --> 00:31:52,520
guest is making and what
assumptions my audience might be

554
00:31:52,520 --> 00:31:55,160
making about the topic to shape
the episode.

555
00:31:55,520 --> 00:31:59,440
I also might try to identify
like any and that helps to shape

556
00:31:59,440 --> 00:32:02,640
it as well.
And it kind of engineers the

557
00:32:02,640 --> 00:32:06,880
episode in a specific direction
because instead of just the

558
00:32:06,880 --> 00:32:10,400
conversation being informational
or like AQ and a or, or just

559
00:32:10,400 --> 00:32:14,280
banter, ranting back and forth,
it's it actually has a purpose

560
00:32:14,280 --> 00:32:16,920
and a focus.
And that really is to bring a

561
00:32:16,920 --> 00:32:19,160
level of enlightenment to the
conversation.

562
00:32:19,160 --> 00:32:24,200
We are assessing you waiting
myths, relooking or re examining

563
00:32:24,200 --> 00:32:28,080
at information.
And so I try to also start my my

564
00:32:28,080 --> 00:32:32,280
podcast.
I don't do it great yet, but I

565
00:32:32,280 --> 00:32:35,160
try not to start the podcast
with a topic.

566
00:32:35,160 --> 00:32:40,080
I try to start with some sort of
a cultural or a personal problem

567
00:32:40,320 --> 00:32:44,120
that people are facing.
And I start with that tension.

568
00:32:44,600 --> 00:32:48,040
The destination for me for the
rest of my, the rest of the

569
00:32:48,040 --> 00:32:52,600
podcast becomes very clear
because now I know what the

570
00:32:52,680 --> 00:32:56,800
challenge is and where what
emotional insights I need to

571
00:32:56,800 --> 00:32:58,920
distill.
And so you guys do a really good

572
00:32:58,920 --> 00:33:02,680
job of this on on this show is
when somebody says something, I

573
00:33:02,680 --> 00:33:04,880
know Ralph does it a lot.
And I think it's good when

574
00:33:04,880 --> 00:33:09,000
somebody says something, Ralph,
when Mark, you're not here a lot

575
00:33:09,000 --> 00:33:13,280
of times and you do it too.
A lot of you guys will summarize

576
00:33:13,440 --> 00:33:15,720
in terms of like this question
that we're answering.

577
00:33:15,920 --> 00:33:19,200
So we all kind of say our piece
and then addled into one

578
00:33:19,200 --> 00:33:23,240
emotional insight or one piece
of activation, information that

579
00:33:23,240 --> 00:33:26,400
someone can use and then take
and apply to their podcast.

580
00:33:27,040 --> 00:33:29,440
Thank you, Tide.
I love all of this.

581
00:33:29,440 --> 00:33:33,680
And yeah, I I definitely do that
intentionally.

582
00:33:33,680 --> 00:33:37,320
I will try to summarize on
occasion what was just spoken

583
00:33:37,680 --> 00:33:40,240
right out of the gate, right?
Like you'll say something, I'll

584
00:33:40,240 --> 00:33:43,120
talk about it, I'll summarize it
and then I'll get into my

585
00:33:43,120 --> 00:33:45,160
answer.
The other thing that I like to

586
00:33:45,160 --> 00:33:50,240
do is also I try to wrap up
summarizing the original

587
00:33:50,240 --> 00:33:52,320
question.
Again, it's a way to kind of

588
00:33:52,320 --> 00:33:55,920
reiterate your point and show
your audience that you've

589
00:33:55,920 --> 00:33:59,120
actually answered the question
that was asked.

590
00:33:59,360 --> 00:34:01,080
And it goes, that goes a long
way.

591
00:34:01,560 --> 00:34:05,160
And by the way, it's something
that while you were sharing

592
00:34:05,160 --> 00:34:08,920
Tide, it reminded me one of the
things I like to do sometimes

593
00:34:08,920 --> 00:34:12,800
with guests, if I like to try to
find out some of their interests

594
00:34:12,800 --> 00:34:16,800
or hobbies outside of what we're
going to actually talk about on

595
00:34:16,800 --> 00:34:19,360
the show.
Because if I can do that and

596
00:34:19,360 --> 00:34:23,520
find a way to ask them about it,
work that in that goes to Alex's

597
00:34:23,520 --> 00:34:27,159
point, again, building that
chemistry, that rapport, right?

598
00:34:27,159 --> 00:34:30,520
So sometimes I, if it's during a
pre interview, I may literally

599
00:34:30,520 --> 00:34:34,639
ask or poke around a little bit
with them and find out what some

600
00:34:34,639 --> 00:34:37,520
of their interests are.
What I really like to do is

601
00:34:37,520 --> 00:34:41,480
Google them a little bit further
than just, again, just not just

602
00:34:41,480 --> 00:34:45,000
the topic, but just learn a
little bit more about them.

603
00:34:45,880 --> 00:34:48,960
Or I'll even stalk their social
media for that regard and see if

604
00:34:48,960 --> 00:34:51,120
they're posting anything of
interest.

605
00:34:51,360 --> 00:34:54,719
And this way I can call to it,
especially if there's something

606
00:34:54,719 --> 00:34:58,080
that we have in common, I'll
say, hey, yeah, I was on your

607
00:34:58,080 --> 00:35:01,200
social media preparing for our
interview and I saw that you

608
00:35:01,200 --> 00:35:03,040
love The Muppets.
I love The Muppets too.

609
00:35:03,040 --> 00:35:05,880
I'm look at my, here's my Kermit
the Frog puppet behind me,

610
00:35:05,880 --> 00:35:08,760
etcetera, etcetera.
It's just a way to loosen things

611
00:35:08,760 --> 00:35:11,280
up, get them feeling more
comfortable.

612
00:35:11,760 --> 00:35:13,440
Yeah.
Sid, I think you had something

613
00:35:13,440 --> 00:35:16,160
while Tide was sharing.
Did you want to say something?

614
00:35:16,560 --> 00:35:18,800
Yes, Sir, I did.
So I brought up a couple of

615
00:35:18,800 --> 00:35:22,440
really good points.
And one of the things that I

616
00:35:22,440 --> 00:35:26,360
have done is when the
conversation goes off track,

617
00:35:26,360 --> 00:35:29,840
because they can go off track,
I'll say something like, hey,

618
00:35:30,040 --> 00:35:33,080
this has been really great, but
I want to go back to what we

619
00:35:33,080 --> 00:35:34,640
were talking about.
I want to go back to the

620
00:35:34,640 --> 00:35:40,000
question and then I take us back
to where before we, you know,

621
00:35:40,000 --> 00:35:42,360
went down the the hole, if you
will.

622
00:35:43,080 --> 00:35:46,520
The other thing that I like to
do is to I learned this and you

623
00:35:46,520 --> 00:35:48,080
know, I was getting my coach
certification.

624
00:35:48,480 --> 00:35:53,080
I like to reframe what the guest
just said, especially if you're

625
00:35:53,080 --> 00:35:56,160
interviewing a tech person or a
business owner that has a tech

626
00:35:56,160 --> 00:35:59,320
company or does something really
complicated, man that can talk

627
00:35:59,320 --> 00:36:03,720
so far over your head.
And so I like to reframe like,

628
00:36:03,760 --> 00:36:05,200
OK, Mark, I just want to make
sure.

629
00:36:05,200 --> 00:36:09,640
Let me let me tell you what I
heard you say was podcasting is

630
00:36:09,640 --> 00:36:12,840
not for the week.
Podcasting takes lots of hours

631
00:36:12,840 --> 00:36:14,600
and it's podcasting is really
expensive.

632
00:36:14,600 --> 00:36:19,000
Did I get that correct?
And so that then is allowing me

633
00:36:19,000 --> 00:36:22,400
to tell the guest what I heard
or the listener what I heard and

634
00:36:22,400 --> 00:36:23,960
what they should have heard as
well.

635
00:36:24,320 --> 00:36:29,200
And then I give the guest the
opportunity to confirm or to

636
00:36:29,200 --> 00:36:30,720
correct me.
And there have been cases that

637
00:36:30,720 --> 00:36:35,160
I've been wrong, which is also
really leaning into like getting

638
00:36:35,160 --> 00:36:38,240
to the meat of the conversation
and allowing them to, you know,

639
00:36:38,240 --> 00:36:41,000
if I heard something, if I heard
it incorrectly, then my audience

640
00:36:41,000 --> 00:36:43,000
heard it incorrectly.
Thank you, Sid.

641
00:36:43,000 --> 00:36:46,680
Appreciate those those insights
and I'm going to keep it going

642
00:36:46,680 --> 00:36:50,720
here just for sake of time.
Ralph, did you want to add

643
00:36:50,720 --> 00:36:52,520
something?
Yeah, I want to add something,

644
00:36:52,520 --> 00:36:53,880
that kind of champion, something
you said.

645
00:36:53,880 --> 00:36:57,160
Mark, here's the deal.
If you are going to be a host,

646
00:36:57,640 --> 00:37:00,720
you got to do your homework.
That's how you prevent these

647
00:37:00,720 --> 00:37:04,880
things in the 1st place.
Have a plan, have a system,

648
00:37:05,240 --> 00:37:08,320
manage the conversation.
I will tell you behind the

649
00:37:08,320 --> 00:37:10,160
scenes, I'm going to spill the
beans here on Mark.

650
00:37:10,560 --> 00:37:13,480
Mark does this and Mark does it
really well.

651
00:37:14,320 --> 00:37:17,480
When Mark puts together a show,
Mark has a plan for the show,

652
00:37:18,360 --> 00:37:21,760
and Mark is an expert at
illustrating and promoting.

653
00:37:21,760 --> 00:37:23,080
Orchestrating is the word I'm
looking for.

654
00:37:23,080 --> 00:37:25,480
Orchestrating that plan.
Well, guess what?

655
00:37:26,040 --> 00:37:30,040
If you're going to host a
conversation, be like Mark, make

656
00:37:30,040 --> 00:37:32,520
sure you have a plan, have
guardrail set up.

657
00:37:33,000 --> 00:37:35,560
I will share and I'm sure Mark
won't mind me saying this before

658
00:37:35,560 --> 00:37:38,000
today's conversation.
Mark has an idea of where he

659
00:37:38,000 --> 00:37:39,800
wants this to go.
Now he's opening it up to the

660
00:37:39,800 --> 00:37:43,880
community because Mark values
all of us, but he understands

661
00:37:43,880 --> 00:37:44,960
it.
There are times when we have to

662
00:37:44,960 --> 00:37:47,640
have a guardrail.
The thing that frustrates me

663
00:37:47,960 --> 00:37:50,680
immensely is when I go on
someone's show and it's just

664
00:37:50,680 --> 00:37:52,160
like this.
We're going to have a stream of

665
00:37:52,160 --> 00:37:55,800
consciousness that's not
valuable to your audience.

666
00:37:56,640 --> 00:37:58,960
Have a plan.
You got to do a little homework.

667
00:37:58,960 --> 00:38:01,000
You know, it's not just some
just let's go have a let's go

668
00:38:01,000 --> 00:38:02,600
hang out and have a beer with
our friends.

669
00:38:02,600 --> 00:38:04,920
That's not what we do here.
Now, there may be a place for

670
00:38:04,920 --> 00:38:08,400
that and you may have a show
that works like that, but I'm

671
00:38:08,400 --> 00:38:11,800
just saying do your homework,
have a structure and and

672
00:38:11,800 --> 00:38:15,320
understand you got to guard your
audience is valuable.

673
00:38:15,960 --> 00:38:19,280
Make sure you're bringing them
value by being prepared for

674
00:38:19,280 --> 00:38:20,760
that.
So Mark, I hope you don't mind

675
00:38:20,760 --> 00:38:23,480
me making a little bit of red
face there a little bit, but

676
00:38:23,480 --> 00:38:26,520
this is what Mark does very,
very well.

677
00:38:27,120 --> 00:38:30,840
Yes, my face matching my Indiana
sweatshirt right now for sure.

678
00:38:31,360 --> 00:38:34,880
And thank you, Ralph.
Yeah, I, that is, I don't know,

679
00:38:34,880 --> 00:38:37,320
for better or for worse, that's
just my style.

680
00:38:37,320 --> 00:38:41,360
I have to have some kind of plan
in front of me.

681
00:38:41,560 --> 00:38:44,360
Even if we end up going off
track.

682
00:38:44,360 --> 00:38:48,840
I'm OK about going off track,
but I, I will have too much

683
00:38:48,840 --> 00:38:52,240
stress and anxiety going in
blindly to an episode.

684
00:38:52,320 --> 00:38:56,040
Sid and I had a conversation not
too long ago, Sid mentioning,

685
00:38:56,040 --> 00:38:59,120
you know, hey, why don't we go
back to some of the old, old

686
00:38:59,120 --> 00:39:03,840
days where it was not a curated
conversation, where it was just,

687
00:39:03,840 --> 00:39:05,920
let's swing it and see what
happens.

688
00:39:06,160 --> 00:39:09,280
And that for me personally just
terrifies me.

689
00:39:09,360 --> 00:39:14,000
I won't sleep at night knowing
that tomorrow we're just going

690
00:39:14,000 --> 00:39:17,280
to wing it.
And again, it's not a knock,

691
00:39:17,280 --> 00:39:19,720
It's not a judgement on those
who do wing it.

692
00:39:19,720 --> 00:39:25,800
It's it's specifically for me
and I can't personally operate

693
00:39:25,800 --> 00:39:27,000
that way.
But see.

694
00:39:27,720 --> 00:39:30,080
It's also pretty
counterintuitive because if

695
00:39:30,080 --> 00:39:32,880
you're not tracking what it is
you're discussing, you have

696
00:39:32,880 --> 00:39:34,840
really no way to avoid
redundancy.

697
00:39:35,160 --> 00:39:38,480
You don't want to talk about the
same thing in a back-to-back

698
00:39:38,480 --> 00:39:41,560
episode because you're not
progressing and insights,

699
00:39:41,560 --> 00:39:43,560
especially if your aim is to
provide something to the

700
00:39:43,560 --> 00:39:46,720
audience that they can take home
and apply to their day-to-day

701
00:39:46,720 --> 00:39:48,800
life.
Yeah, fair enough.

702
00:39:48,800 --> 00:39:52,000
That makes yeah perfect sense.
Thank you BC.

703
00:39:52,280 --> 00:40:00,560
OK.
Let's dive into the wheel jargon

704
00:40:00,560 --> 00:40:04,040
before we do, and I know I say
that wrong jargon is the right

705
00:40:04,040 --> 00:40:08,880
way to say it, and we'll dive
into one more mailbag after

706
00:40:08,880 --> 00:40:13,120
this, so stick with us.
The idea of this wheel is there

707
00:40:13,120 --> 00:40:16,280
are lots of terms in podcasting
and content creation that get

708
00:40:16,280 --> 00:40:19,600
thrown around a lot.
Sometimes we here on the show

709
00:40:19,840 --> 00:40:23,000
take advantage of that.
We assume that you know what all

710
00:40:23,000 --> 00:40:26,000
of these terms mean, and quite
frankly, we have a lot of newer

711
00:40:26,000 --> 00:40:29,880
podcasters in our audience.
So I want to make sure we are

712
00:40:30,040 --> 00:40:32,840
accommodating them as well.
So I'm going to go ahead and

713
00:40:32,840 --> 00:40:35,280
spin this wheel.
If you can't hear it on

714
00:40:35,280 --> 00:40:39,080
Clubhouse or elsewhere, don't
worry, it'll be heard on the

715
00:40:39,080 --> 00:40:41,760
podcast.
But it is spinning as we speak

716
00:40:41,760 --> 00:40:45,080
right now.
Let's see where it lands.

717
00:40:46,840 --> 00:40:52,200
Always takes a moment for it to
finally OK this.

718
00:40:52,200 --> 00:40:54,840
Well, I was going to say this
might be more opinion than

719
00:40:55,320 --> 00:40:58,040
anything, but no, I think there
are clear definitions to this

720
00:40:58,680 --> 00:41:03,040
community versus audience.
So a lot of times people will

721
00:41:03,040 --> 00:41:06,240
throw out the term audience,
right?

722
00:41:06,240 --> 00:41:09,240
And do they really mean that?
So I'm curious, what do you

723
00:41:09,240 --> 00:41:12,200
think?
What is the difference between

724
00:41:12,200 --> 00:41:16,880
having a community and having an
audience who would like to

725
00:41:16,880 --> 00:41:18,160
share?
Go ahead BC.

726
00:41:18,400 --> 00:41:22,080
So my off the cuff definition,
not not to be too off the cuff,

727
00:41:22,480 --> 00:41:26,720
but I would say the audience,
your ideal audience base, that's

728
00:41:26,720 --> 00:41:32,160
your ideal demographic of people
that you are aiming to engage

729
00:41:32,160 --> 00:41:35,720
with at any given point during
your show.

730
00:41:36,200 --> 00:41:41,760
Your, you've based your topic,
your format, your frequency,

731
00:41:41,760 --> 00:41:46,600
your sector of your podcast
around this ideal group of

732
00:41:46,600 --> 00:41:50,920
people you're hoping will engage
with your show as you produce

733
00:41:50,920 --> 00:41:54,240
it, as it goes out there, as it
lives in the digital ether.

734
00:41:54,960 --> 00:41:59,080
And then I would distinctify,
that's not a word, but I would

735
00:41:59,080 --> 00:42:04,440
distinctify the community as the
portion of that audience that

736
00:42:04,440 --> 00:42:09,400
has engaged in a way that they
have showcased some form of

737
00:42:09,400 --> 00:42:14,720
loyalty, whether or not that's
signing up for a newsletter,

738
00:42:14,800 --> 00:42:18,600
joining your Substack,
connecting on social media.

739
00:42:18,920 --> 00:42:23,360
You notice that they are
commonly downloading pretty

740
00:42:23,440 --> 00:42:26,600
consistently your episodes as
they come out, they're

741
00:42:26,960 --> 00:42:30,600
commenting things like that.
I would call that engaged sub

742
00:42:30,600 --> 00:42:33,480
sect of your target audience,
the community.

743
00:42:33,480 --> 00:42:37,240
So in review audience, the group
of people that you hope to

744
00:42:37,240 --> 00:42:40,920
engage with, community is the
sect of that audience that has

745
00:42:40,920 --> 00:42:43,640
engaged and are consistently
engaged.

746
00:42:44,440 --> 00:42:47,160
Yeah, I'm right there with you
BC and yeah, I could say that

747
00:42:47,160 --> 00:42:51,800
that those audience members are
the equivalent of those download

748
00:42:51,800 --> 00:42:55,000
numbers that you see on your
podcast hosting platform.

749
00:42:55,000 --> 00:42:58,520
That's your audience, right?
And you know, granted, the

750
00:42:58,520 --> 00:43:03,040
people that join us in the
mornings alive are, are quote,

751
00:43:03,040 --> 00:43:05,640
UN quote, audience members.
I call them audience because

752
00:43:05,640 --> 00:43:08,120
that's the terminology used here
on Clubhouse.

753
00:43:08,320 --> 00:43:12,520
But in my mind, I really
consider those people community,

754
00:43:12,560 --> 00:43:16,200
especially the ones I'm looking
at right now here on stage on

755
00:43:16,200 --> 00:43:18,720
Clubhouse.
These are people that regularly

756
00:43:18,720 --> 00:43:21,840
show up in the mornings to
listen to this show.

757
00:43:21,840 --> 00:43:24,960
I consider those people
community members, right?

758
00:43:24,960 --> 00:43:27,680
Because they are engaging, they
are participating.

759
00:43:28,280 --> 00:43:32,520
Tide, who's on stage with us
every day, she I can absolutely

760
00:43:32,520 --> 00:43:35,240
consider a community member, not
an audience member.

761
00:43:35,240 --> 00:43:39,280
To BC's point, she's not
somebody that's just listening

762
00:43:39,280 --> 00:43:42,120
that I hope to engage with.
This is a person who engages

763
00:43:42,120 --> 00:43:45,960
with us every day.
Sid, did you want to add on to

764
00:43:45,960 --> 00:43:48,080
this?
I'm going to say the same thing,

765
00:43:48,080 --> 00:43:49,440
but I'm going to say it
differently, OK?

766
00:43:50,200 --> 00:43:52,200
An audience is people who
listen.

767
00:43:52,480 --> 00:43:54,440
The community is people who
engage.

768
00:43:55,080 --> 00:43:58,040
Yeah, putting it quite simply,
that is the best way to put it.

769
00:43:58,040 --> 00:43:59,200
Yeah.
Thank you, Sid.

770
00:43:59,920 --> 00:44:02,400
All right, so that is the wheel
of jargon.

771
00:44:02,720 --> 00:44:07,560
This is the mailbag.
If you could only see me on

772
00:44:07,560 --> 00:44:11,320
video, I hope you come to
podcastingmorningchat.com/join

773
00:44:11,320 --> 00:44:15,040
us to find out how you can see
us on video, because I do that.

774
00:44:15,280 --> 00:44:18,200
That sound effect.
Very makeshift.

775
00:44:18,280 --> 00:44:22,760
It is quite literally me moving
out of the way from my

776
00:44:22,760 --> 00:44:26,720
microphone to shuffle a bunch of
papers for you.

777
00:44:26,720 --> 00:44:30,320
All right, so this next mailbag
question and actually, Jonathan,

778
00:44:30,320 --> 00:44:35,120
this might be one for you.
Let me make sure I still have

779
00:44:35,120 --> 00:44:36,280
it.
Yes, I have it right here in

780
00:44:36,280 --> 00:44:39,720
front of me.
This comes from Reddit as a

781
00:44:39,720 --> 00:44:44,960
matter of fact, and it says I'm
a 28 year old female and work at

782
00:44:45,240 --> 00:44:48,480
a medical device company.
But I've always wanted to do

783
00:44:48,480 --> 00:44:50,720
something more creative with my
life.

784
00:44:51,280 --> 00:44:53,800
When I was younger I tried
acting and music but things

785
00:44:53,800 --> 00:44:55,400
didn't work out the way I had
hoped.

786
00:44:56,040 --> 00:45:00,240
At some point I started telling
myself maybe I was just being

787
00:45:00,240 --> 00:45:04,400
overly optimistic.
She goes on to say.

788
00:45:04,400 --> 00:45:07,240
Recently I've been thinking
about starting a podcast.

789
00:45:07,240 --> 00:45:11,360
My idea isn't necessarily to
become famous, but more to talk

790
00:45:12,160 --> 00:45:14,600
with interesting people and
learn from different

791
00:45:14,640 --> 00:45:17,120
perspectives.
The thing that makes me hesitate

792
00:45:17,120 --> 00:45:21,760
is that most successful podcast
today seem to start with people

793
00:45:21,760 --> 00:45:25,400
who already have a platform on
TikTok, Instagram or YouTube.

794
00:45:26,200 --> 00:45:29,160
I don't really have a following
like that, so part of me wonders

795
00:45:29,160 --> 00:45:33,000
who would even listen.
How many people have asked that

796
00:45:33,000 --> 00:45:35,680
question out loud in this
community?

797
00:45:36,000 --> 00:45:38,880
I also know part of the problem
is me.

798
00:45:38,880 --> 00:45:41,840
If one thing goes wrong, my
brain immediately assumes the

799
00:45:41,840 --> 00:45:45,280
whole idea won't work and I
abandoned it before giving it a

800
00:45:45,280 --> 00:45:49,440
real chance.
I can relate to that big time.

801
00:45:50,720 --> 00:45:53,000
She finishes up by saying.
So I'm curious, for people who

802
00:45:53,000 --> 00:45:56,520
started podcasts without an
existing audience, how realistic

803
00:45:56,520 --> 00:46:00,880
is it to grow one from scratch?
Great question, Jonathan, I'm

804
00:46:00,880 --> 00:46:02,640
going to come to you, but I'm
going to give you a minute to

805
00:46:02,640 --> 00:46:05,200
think that over.
I'll give you that minute while

806
00:46:05,200 --> 00:46:08,480
BC responds first.
To go to a real life example, I

807
00:46:08,480 --> 00:46:11,760
have a client who is post
retirement.

808
00:46:11,760 --> 00:46:13,600
She comes from the health
industry.

809
00:46:13,600 --> 00:46:18,320
She previously had no social
media.

810
00:46:18,320 --> 00:46:22,480
She has never podcasted before,
but she wanted to get into the

811
00:46:22,480 --> 00:46:26,560
digital storytelling realm.
And I can confirm as of this

812
00:46:26,560 --> 00:46:29,480
morning, I'm going to have a
meeting with her later today

813
00:46:29,800 --> 00:46:33,240
that in the past month, again,
having no previous social media,

814
00:46:33,240 --> 00:46:37,400
having no previous following
anywhere, she on Facebook, which

815
00:46:37,400 --> 00:46:43,600
is her primary form of
engagement, she's had over 370

816
00:46:43,600 --> 00:46:46,440
views in just the past month
alone.

817
00:46:46,440 --> 00:46:51,240
She's seen engagement and that's
just from posting a couple times

818
00:46:51,240 --> 00:46:53,440
a week with consistent weekly
episodes.

819
00:46:53,440 --> 00:46:59,200
So there's definitely an
absolute ground for you to build

820
00:46:59,200 --> 00:47:02,360
something organic.
And again, at this kind of goes

821
00:47:02,360 --> 00:47:07,640
back to us saying don't compare
yourselves to the anomalous.

822
00:47:07,640 --> 00:47:11,400
And granted, she didn't mention
the Joe Rogan or Logan Paul, any

823
00:47:11,400 --> 00:47:13,840
of them crazy anomalous
anomalous podcasters.

824
00:47:13,840 --> 00:47:18,160
But yes, it is a smart marketing
choice if you have already a

825
00:47:18,160 --> 00:47:20,160
following somewhere to bring
them into podcasting.

826
00:47:20,160 --> 00:47:23,400
But you don't have to have that.
Yeah, Thank you.

827
00:47:23,400 --> 00:47:27,360
BCII tend to agree with you.
I mean, I worry about this

828
00:47:27,360 --> 00:47:30,520
particular person, right?
Because I think that most of us

829
00:47:30,520 --> 00:47:34,640
here would probably agree that
you can do this.

830
00:47:34,640 --> 00:47:38,280
You can grow an audience from
scratch using a podcast.

831
00:47:38,560 --> 00:47:43,120
And if you're not making any
major effort, whether it's

832
00:47:43,120 --> 00:47:47,280
financial or time to help grow
that audience, grow that

833
00:47:47,280 --> 00:47:50,280
community, then it's going to be
a slow burn.

834
00:47:50,280 --> 00:47:52,280
It's going to probably take a
while.

835
00:47:52,800 --> 00:47:58,800
Look, this very community I've
done up until recent and even

836
00:47:58,800 --> 00:48:02,880
then some for that matter, I
have done very little to promote

837
00:48:02,880 --> 00:48:05,440
this.
And we've been at it now for

838
00:48:05,440 --> 00:48:08,680
four years, right.
And I would still consider our

839
00:48:08,680 --> 00:48:12,120
podcast following relatively
small.

840
00:48:12,600 --> 00:48:16,560
And, and now I'm recognizing
that there are some things I

841
00:48:16,560 --> 00:48:19,880
want to do, need to do if I want
to grow this community.

842
00:48:19,880 --> 00:48:23,400
And that's going to take some
more time and probably a

843
00:48:23,400 --> 00:48:26,400
financial investment.
But I'm not saying that this is

844
00:48:26,400 --> 00:48:29,080
something you have to do.
I'm just saying that if you are

845
00:48:29,080 --> 00:48:33,080
someone like this person who
says the, the problem that they

846
00:48:33,080 --> 00:48:36,360
believe is partially themselves,
because if something goes wrong,

847
00:48:36,360 --> 00:48:38,840
they immediately assume the
whole idea doesn't work and they

848
00:48:38,840 --> 00:48:42,560
abandon it.
That's that's where I get

849
00:48:42,560 --> 00:48:45,800
concerned for this person.
So I think that this person

850
00:48:45,800 --> 00:48:50,880
really would want to consider a
real strategy for growth if

851
00:48:50,880 --> 00:48:54,960
they're going to go in this and
not only focus on the content

852
00:48:54,960 --> 00:48:57,160
itself.
That's that's a big part of it

853
00:48:57,160 --> 00:49:01,000
and it starts with your content,
but I think you need a strategy

854
00:49:01,000 --> 00:49:04,200
built in there as well.
Ralph, I know you like to talk

855
00:49:04,200 --> 00:49:05,960
about strategies.
Go for it.

856
00:49:06,600 --> 00:49:08,080
Yeah.
And what I want to say here to

857
00:49:08,120 --> 00:49:11,360
answer this question is what is
your why?

858
00:49:11,920 --> 00:49:16,240
Before you do anything else,
define what your why is.

859
00:49:16,240 --> 00:49:19,160
And then once you define what
your why is, how are you going

860
00:49:19,160 --> 00:49:22,280
to measure success?
Because there's a bunch of ways

861
00:49:22,280 --> 00:49:25,440
to measure success.
You can measure with downloads.

862
00:49:25,480 --> 00:49:27,520
I don't think that's a good
measure of success.

863
00:49:28,160 --> 00:49:30,160
You can measure with
interactions of people.

864
00:49:30,160 --> 00:49:32,960
You can measure with money.
I like money side of stuff, but

865
00:49:32,960 --> 00:49:37,080
know your why and know what the
measurement is because that's

866
00:49:37,080 --> 00:49:38,760
the thing that's going to keep
you going.

867
00:49:39,160 --> 00:49:41,720
You may not have anybody to
start off with, Mark and you and

868
00:49:41,720 --> 00:49:44,320
I probably agree with this, that
that is a hard slog when you do

869
00:49:44,320 --> 00:49:46,600
that.
That is not easy if you're not

870
00:49:46,600 --> 00:49:49,280
speaking to somebody.
The discoverability is not a

871
00:49:49,280 --> 00:49:51,440
simple process.
A lot of people think, well, I'm

872
00:49:51,440 --> 00:49:53,440
just going to put it out there
and people are going to find it

873
00:49:53,440 --> 00:49:55,520
magically.
I got a news for you.

874
00:49:55,520 --> 00:49:57,240
It doesn't usually happen like
that.

875
00:49:57,880 --> 00:50:00,760
You know, it's word of mouth,
it's one-on-one, but know your

876
00:50:00,760 --> 00:50:03,120
why.
Build a system around how you're

877
00:50:03,120 --> 00:50:05,480
going to measure if you are
being successful.

878
00:50:05,480 --> 00:50:09,480
Because the other side of this,
it's success is what you define

879
00:50:09,480 --> 00:50:12,760
success to be.
It's not what other people say

880
00:50:12,760 --> 00:50:14,880
that it is.
And I think a lot of people get

881
00:50:14,880 --> 00:50:18,160
burned out in podcasting because
they look at success by these

882
00:50:18,160 --> 00:50:22,400
metrics of followers and viral
videos and downloads that may

883
00:50:22,400 --> 00:50:26,520
not be success for you.
You can have 10 downloads and be

884
00:50:26,600 --> 00:50:30,680
extremely successful.
I have one show that it's it

885
00:50:30,680 --> 00:50:32,720
doesn't get a lot of downloads,
but it's successful because

886
00:50:32,720 --> 00:50:35,840
people push back to me.
It's a way for me to speak

887
00:50:35,840 --> 00:50:38,520
what's in my heart.
So know what your why is and

888
00:50:38,520 --> 00:50:40,080
know what how you measure that
success.

889
00:50:40,080 --> 00:50:41,560
Mark, thanks for letting me
chime in with that.

890
00:50:42,040 --> 00:50:43,880
Thank you, Ralph.
I appreciate it.

891
00:50:43,880 --> 00:50:48,480
Yes, with you there fully,
wholeheartedly.

892
00:50:48,960 --> 00:50:52,840
Jonathan, are you able to talk?
I know you have a docking, A

893
00:50:53,080 --> 00:50:58,280
dogging bark, a barking dog in
the background.

894
00:50:58,760 --> 00:51:00,240
Oh, wait.
Let's see if he can chime in.

895
00:51:00,240 --> 00:51:01,400
Go ahead.
Yeah.

896
00:51:01,400 --> 00:51:06,400
So I mean, you can start.
You can start small.

897
00:51:07,800 --> 00:51:09,600
There's a lot of things that you
can do.

898
00:51:09,600 --> 00:51:12,800
I think starting within an
existing community, you know,

899
00:51:12,800 --> 00:51:15,720
find Facebook groups and stuff
that's gonna help you build

900
00:51:15,720 --> 00:51:21,080
quicker, you know, small and
mighty small and loyal is better

901
00:51:21,080 --> 00:51:24,920
than anything.
So even if you've got 10 really

902
00:51:24,920 --> 00:51:29,000
great people that listen to your
podcast that you're impacting,

903
00:51:29,000 --> 00:51:31,520
that's, that's powerful.
That makes a difference.

904
00:51:32,160 --> 00:51:33,800
Yeah, thank you, Jonathan.
I think that's a really

905
00:51:33,800 --> 00:51:36,120
important point.
It's focusing on the people that

906
00:51:36,120 --> 00:51:40,000
you do have that are listening,
even if it is 10 people,

907
00:51:40,160 --> 00:51:43,160
focusing on who they are,
getting to know them,

908
00:51:43,160 --> 00:51:46,640
appreciating them, showing them
gratitude, getting them

909
00:51:46,640 --> 00:51:49,280
involved.
These are ways that you can

910
00:51:49,720 --> 00:51:53,520
focus less on oh how many more
people are coming through that

911
00:51:53,520 --> 00:51:57,360
door and start focusing more on
those people that are there so

912
00:51:57,360 --> 00:52:01,760
that you can better understand
why it is that these people are

913
00:52:01,760 --> 00:52:05,360
interested in your content and
do more of that to find more

914
00:52:05,360 --> 00:52:08,120
like minded people.
Sid, did you want to add

915
00:52:08,120 --> 00:52:10,400
something?
Yeah, I was thinking about my

916
00:52:10,400 --> 00:52:13,360
journey as I was listening to
everybody here.

917
00:52:13,840 --> 00:52:18,160
And her question is about is, is
it unrealistic to start a

918
00:52:18,160 --> 00:52:20,720
podcast with no audience or no
social media following?

919
00:52:20,720 --> 00:52:22,040
Thank you for putting that into
the chat.

920
00:52:22,040 --> 00:52:25,440
Rough.
And the reality is we all have

921
00:52:25,440 --> 00:52:27,560
an audience.
We just don't call them that.

922
00:52:28,800 --> 00:52:31,960
I had people that followed me.
I had people that were connected

923
00:52:31,960 --> 00:52:33,640
with me when I started my
podcast.

924
00:52:34,000 --> 00:52:35,240
I had people that had bought for
me.

925
00:52:35,240 --> 00:52:36,520
I had people that I'd worked
with.

926
00:52:36,960 --> 00:52:40,920
And so this young lady, whoever
she is, she's got a network of

927
00:52:40,920 --> 00:52:42,840
people.
It's called a network of people

928
00:52:43,480 --> 00:52:46,800
that likely will listen because
most of us, especially those of

929
00:52:46,800 --> 00:52:49,120
us that started from scratch,
the first people that listened

930
00:52:49,120 --> 00:52:51,760
to our show were our friends and
our family and then we grew from

931
00:52:51,760 --> 00:52:54,080
there.
So I would wager to bet she

932
00:52:54,080 --> 00:52:57,200
already has a network of people
that would likely because they

933
00:52:57,200 --> 00:53:00,480
like her, maybe because they
know her would TuneIn to hear

934
00:53:00,480 --> 00:53:03,640
what she's going to talk about.
There were people that tuned in

935
00:53:03,640 --> 00:53:06,000
because they know me and they
like me and they trust me.

936
00:53:06,520 --> 00:53:08,280
So I think we all have a built
in network.

937
00:53:09,080 --> 00:53:10,160
Agreed.
Yeah.

938
00:53:10,160 --> 00:53:13,280
And that's how I've always
started, by recruiting my

939
00:53:13,280 --> 00:53:17,120
personal and professional
networks and with every podcast

940
00:53:17,120 --> 00:53:19,960
venture I've had and with every
podcast client, that's what I

941
00:53:19,960 --> 00:53:22,600
recommend to them as well as one
strategy.

942
00:53:23,120 --> 00:53:25,040
Yeah.
Tap into those people that know

943
00:53:25,040 --> 00:53:28,080
you, that you know are more
likely to support what you're

944
00:53:28,080 --> 00:53:30,040
doing.
It's a good start.

945
00:53:30,040 --> 00:53:33,880
It's not necessarily something
you want to rest your hat on

946
00:53:33,880 --> 00:53:36,920
long term, right?
Because you do want to grow this

947
00:53:36,920 --> 00:53:40,280
audience and your personal
network may not always resonate

948
00:53:40,280 --> 00:53:43,720
with the content that you're
making, but it is a great place

949
00:53:43,720 --> 00:53:45,600
to start.
I'm with you there, Sid.

950
00:53:45,880 --> 00:53:47,200
Ralph, did you have more you
wanted to add?

951
00:53:47,200 --> 00:53:49,280
Yeah, I just wanted to add one
thing to what Sid just said,

952
00:53:49,280 --> 00:53:51,040
because I think we can all learn
from that.

953
00:53:51,400 --> 00:53:54,720
And what Sid is really saying is
you, we all have an audience

954
00:53:54,720 --> 00:53:56,400
already, and I think that's
ideal.

955
00:53:56,720 --> 00:53:59,960
Here's what you can do.
Say to your audience, hey, if

956
00:53:59,960 --> 00:54:02,960
you're getting value from what
I'm bringing you, tell somebody,

957
00:54:03,640 --> 00:54:05,480
tell a friend.
You know, I'll give you a church

958
00:54:05,480 --> 00:54:07,720
example.
At church sometimes we say bring

959
00:54:07,720 --> 00:54:09,960
a friend Sunday.
It works.

960
00:54:10,360 --> 00:54:13,280
It works because you are the
best ambassador.

961
00:54:13,280 --> 00:54:17,200
Your people, those core 10
people are or your die hard

962
00:54:17,200 --> 00:54:19,280
people are your brand
ambassadors.

963
00:54:19,680 --> 00:54:21,920
Reach out to them and say, like,
I end my show sometimes.

964
00:54:21,920 --> 00:54:24,760
Hey, if you got value today, one
of the best ways you can help

965
00:54:24,760 --> 00:54:26,840
your friend is to tell them
about the show.

966
00:54:27,120 --> 00:54:28,680
I think that is a brilliant
thing.

967
00:54:28,680 --> 00:54:31,280
And I think Sid was was saying
that is that we all have an

968
00:54:31,280 --> 00:54:33,880
audience.
Ask that audience to speak to

969
00:54:33,880 --> 00:54:35,360
other people and that's the way
it grows.

970
00:54:35,480 --> 00:54:38,880
This is the best way to grow A
podcast is word of mouth,

971
00:54:39,080 --> 00:54:41,720
one-on-one people telling
another person and tells another

972
00:54:41,720 --> 00:54:44,760
person and tells another person.
That's how you really grow.

973
00:54:44,760 --> 00:54:47,120
So, Sid, I champion what you
said, my friend.

974
00:54:47,480 --> 00:54:51,040
Yeah, and I see Sid was not
going that right back to you

975
00:54:51,040 --> 00:54:52,680
while you were sharing there.
Ralph.

976
00:54:52,680 --> 00:54:54,200
We have some synergy there for
sure.

977
00:54:54,200 --> 00:54:56,680
And I think this is a great
place to wrap up today's

978
00:54:56,960 --> 00:54:59,520
conversation.
So thank you all for some really

979
00:54:59,520 --> 00:55:02,960
good discussions today.
I hope that this served a lot of

980
00:55:02,960 --> 00:55:05,160
people.
I think there was a lot of value

981
00:55:05,160 --> 00:55:08,120
to be had here.
And a reminder that we're back

982
00:55:08,120 --> 00:55:12,200
tomorrow, 7:00 AM Eastern Time,
covering all the news around the

983
00:55:12,200 --> 00:55:15,480
world of podcasting and sharing
our thoughts and opinions of

984
00:55:15,920 --> 00:55:18,960
those different stories.
So come check that out and be in

985
00:55:18,960 --> 00:55:21,120
the know.
I think it'll be helpful for you

986
00:55:21,160 --> 00:55:24,200
as a content creator.
And then again, remember

987
00:55:24,240 --> 00:55:27,200
Thursday, it's our podcast on
episode.

988
00:55:27,560 --> 00:55:31,240
Bring your favorite charity,
nonprofit organization,

989
00:55:31,240 --> 00:55:34,920
etcetera, that you think
deserves to be supported and

990
00:55:34,920 --> 00:55:37,640
share a little bit about why
you're bringing that along the

991
00:55:37,640 --> 00:55:41,240
way.
So tomorrow, What News Thursday

992
00:55:41,360 --> 00:55:45,200
Podcast on, more to come on the
rest of the week, and a big

993
00:55:45,200 --> 00:55:47,280
announcement tomorrow as well,
by the way.

994
00:55:47,280 --> 00:55:51,760
So stick around for that and
until tomorrow, make it a great

995
00:55:51,760 --> 00:55:53,240
day everybody, take care.