442. Why Song Exploder’s Fleetwood Mac Episode Is Gold for Indie Podcasters

1
00:00:04,920 --> 00:00:06,840
Good morning podcasting Morning
chat.

2
00:00:07,080 --> 00:00:14,360
Today is Tuesday, January 27th,
2026 and today inside song

3
00:00:14,360 --> 00:00:18,160
exploders storytelling magic.
We explore how walking listeners

4
00:00:18,200 --> 00:00:21,960
through emotion, choices and
uncertainty makes this podcast

5
00:00:22,000 --> 00:00:26,760
endlessly re listenable.
So if you're listening live on

6
00:00:26,760 --> 00:00:28,840
Clubhouse, hit the share button,
bottom left hand side of the

7
00:00:28,840 --> 00:00:31,520
screen and share it.
However, Clubhouse lets you.

8
00:00:31,920 --> 00:00:34,600
And if you're catching us via
podcast, YouTube, LinkedIn,

9
00:00:34,600 --> 00:00:37,360
etcetera, please share this
episode with a fellow podcaster.

10
00:00:38,920 --> 00:00:42,720
And now give us about 30 seconds
and we'll get things rolling.

11
00:00:43,200 --> 00:01:22,120
Thanks for being here.
Good morning again podcasting

12
00:01:22,120 --> 00:01:23,840
Morning Chat.
Thanks so much for being here.

13
00:01:23,840 --> 00:01:28,040
I am your host, Mark Ronic and
on stage with me currently we

14
00:01:28,040 --> 00:01:32,120
have Jonathan Howard, producer
Ashley Feller, Ralph Estep, Dr.

15
00:01:32,120 --> 00:01:35,240
Faye, Sid Meadows and BC
Babbles.

16
00:01:35,240 --> 00:01:37,720
And if you want to learn more
about any of those fine people

17
00:01:37,720 --> 00:01:41,160
that I just mentioned, just go
to podcastingmorningchat.com.

18
00:01:41,160 --> 00:01:44,720
Head over to the about section
and you can see everyone's bio.

19
00:01:44,720 --> 00:01:47,680
See how you can connect with
them outside of the podcasting

20
00:01:47,680 --> 00:01:53,120
morning chat if you so choose.
And yes, we did cancel

21
00:01:53,120 --> 00:01:55,240
yesterday's show.
I did have power.

22
00:01:55,240 --> 00:01:58,800
I'm grateful for that.
I never lost power, but I know a

23
00:01:58,800 --> 00:02:01,520
lot of people were dealing with
it, whether it was on this team

24
00:02:01,520 --> 00:02:05,200
or somebody listening.
I just figured, you know what,

25
00:02:05,200 --> 00:02:08,080
let's let everybody focus on
being warm and safe.

26
00:02:08,840 --> 00:02:13,400
I felt podcasting discussions
could all go on hold and we

27
00:02:13,400 --> 00:02:17,720
could pick up things today.
But before we do pick up things,

28
00:02:18,000 --> 00:02:22,080
we're missing Nick this morning
who is without power.

29
00:02:22,080 --> 00:02:27,200
He's from the West Virginia
area, and he's sending us texts

30
00:02:27,200 --> 00:02:31,520
and pictures right now via a
text string that I have going

31
00:02:31,520 --> 00:02:34,520
on.
And he's definitely in the thick

32
00:02:34,520 --> 00:02:38,320
of it in that area.
Lots of downed trees, roads look

33
00:02:38,320 --> 00:02:41,560
pretty treacherous.
So good luck to Nick.

34
00:02:41,560 --> 00:02:44,240
They're actually staying with
friends 'cause as some of you

35
00:02:44,240 --> 00:02:46,600
know, he's got a little one
there.

36
00:02:46,600 --> 00:02:50,160
So I'm sure not good conditions
in their house.

37
00:02:50,160 --> 00:02:52,240
So they decided to go to someone
else's.

38
00:02:52,240 --> 00:02:56,040
So good luck to the null backs.
And I was curious if we could

39
00:02:56,040 --> 00:02:58,600
just go down the line, maybe
rapid fire this.

40
00:02:58,600 --> 00:03:01,720
I'm curious, say if we can go
down the line starting with

41
00:03:01,720 --> 00:03:07,480
Jonathan, say where you're from
and then how much snow you got.

42
00:03:07,480 --> 00:03:10,120
And then if you want any power
outage, if you're dealing with

43
00:03:10,120 --> 00:03:14,000
one, which I'm guessing most of
us have power that are here, but

44
00:03:14,320 --> 00:03:17,600
Jonathan, take it away.
All right, Poughkeepsie, NY in

45
00:03:17,600 --> 00:03:19,560
nearly 2 feet of snow.
Wow.

46
00:03:19,920 --> 00:03:21,440
But we kept power the whole
time.

47
00:03:21,600 --> 00:03:24,600
That's awesome that because I
would imagine with three little

48
00:03:24,600 --> 00:03:28,440
three dogs, that would be a pain
in the butt and having no power.

49
00:03:28,600 --> 00:03:31,000
Yeah, cool.
All right.

50
00:03:31,000 --> 00:03:34,640
And Ashley, you're up.
I'm from Panama City Beach, FL,

51
00:03:34,640 --> 00:03:37,480
we are not participating in this
winter storm y'all.

52
00:03:37,600 --> 00:03:39,320
That's a good point.
Forgot about that.

53
00:03:40,400 --> 00:03:41,720
And I knew that.
Just forgot.

54
00:03:41,840 --> 00:03:43,760
Let's go to Ralph.
How about you, Ralph?

55
00:03:44,240 --> 00:03:47,080
Yes, we got about a foot of snow
here, but worse than that, we've

56
00:03:47,080 --> 00:03:49,800
got like a Krispy Kreme glaze on
everything here.

57
00:03:50,120 --> 00:03:53,520
So the ice on top of that well,
but I will say the cows are

58
00:03:53,520 --> 00:03:56,880
managing well through the storm.
I raised Black Angus cows here

59
00:03:56,880 --> 00:03:59,800
on the farm and they seem to be
coping with the the cold.

60
00:03:59,800 --> 00:04:02,400
It's going to be 1° today, so
that's going to be an

61
00:04:02,400 --> 00:04:04,200
interesting day.
But thanks for checking in.

62
00:04:04,280 --> 00:04:06,640
And I have power.
I've got 2 backup generators so

63
00:04:06,640 --> 00:04:08,400
even if the power goes out I'm
in pretty good shape.

64
00:04:08,440 --> 00:04:11,040
Yeah, you're lucky.
That's something that I always

65
00:04:11,040 --> 00:04:14,760
say I want to invest in and then
realize I haven't invested when

66
00:04:14,760 --> 00:04:17,760
I need it.
So that's a great thing to have

67
00:04:17,760 --> 00:04:19,240
those generators.
Ralph.

68
00:04:19,240 --> 00:04:24,160
All right, Dr. coming to you.
Yeah, I'm in Nashville, TN, and

69
00:04:24,280 --> 00:04:29,280
although we only had about two
inches built up on the railing

70
00:04:29,280 --> 00:04:34,600
of our deck, it's the ice, man.
It's the ice that is just

71
00:04:35,200 --> 00:04:38,280
killing us.
And you could lay there at night

72
00:04:38,280 --> 00:04:44,120
and hear pop, pop.
And that's like a tree that has

73
00:04:44,760 --> 00:04:48,320
either come.
I mean, you see film of them

74
00:04:48,720 --> 00:04:53,960
combusting and they fall and
sometimes they miss your car and

75
00:04:53,960 --> 00:04:56,040
sometimes they do not miss your
car.

76
00:04:56,480 --> 00:04:59,000
And you've been dealing with
power outages on and off too,

77
00:04:59,000 --> 00:05:01,600
right?
Dealing with power outages on

78
00:05:01,600 --> 00:05:04,720
and off the house across the
street from this caught on fire.

79
00:05:05,640 --> 00:05:09,280
It's been quite a weekend.
I'm sure.

80
00:05:09,280 --> 00:05:10,920
Well, I'm glad that you are
safe.

81
00:05:10,920 --> 00:05:13,040
I'm glad you still have power as
well.

82
00:05:13,040 --> 00:05:15,160
And wishing the best to your
neighbors.

83
00:05:15,160 --> 00:05:15,960
I know you.
Yeah.

84
00:05:15,960 --> 00:05:19,080
You said there was a fire.
You told us over the weekend.

85
00:05:19,080 --> 00:05:20,520
So I hope everybody.
'S doing OK.

86
00:05:20,600 --> 00:05:23,360
Yeah, their gas water tank blew
up.

87
00:05:23,400 --> 00:05:26,920
Wow, that's scary.
How about you, Sid, in the Texas

88
00:05:26,920 --> 00:05:27,600
area?
Good.

89
00:05:28,720 --> 00:05:30,440
Morning, everybody.
We're in the Dallas Fort Worth

90
00:05:30,440 --> 00:05:34,440
area or North Fort Worth, and we
don't have any snow.

91
00:05:34,600 --> 00:05:38,240
We have about 3 inches of sleet
and ice.

92
00:05:38,920 --> 00:05:41,520
It does have a glaze on it like
Ralph was talking about.

93
00:05:41,520 --> 00:05:45,520
It's compacted down and
fortunately, because we did not

94
00:05:45,520 --> 00:05:47,960
have freezing rain, we only had
sleet.

95
00:05:48,400 --> 00:05:52,840
Sleet does not stick to the
trees and so we did not have any

96
00:05:52,840 --> 00:05:56,040
trees down, no power lines down,
no power outage.

97
00:05:56,040 --> 00:05:58,960
We were prepared for it, but we
did not have any of that.

98
00:05:58,960 --> 00:06:01,400
So thank goodness we got sleet
and not freezing rain.

99
00:06:01,760 --> 00:06:03,720
Good.
I'm glad you guys are doing OK.

100
00:06:04,080 --> 00:06:06,480
And then we'll go to BC.
Go ahead BC.

101
00:06:07,280 --> 00:06:09,840
Yeah, over here on the eastern
side of Lake Norman, just north

102
00:06:09,840 --> 00:06:15,040
of Charlotte, we got all sleet
and all a whopping .1 inches of

103
00:06:15,040 --> 00:06:17,320
it.
It's kind of half melted at this

104
00:06:17,320 --> 00:06:18,560
point.
I'm sure there's plenty of black

105
00:06:18,560 --> 00:06:21,760
ice out there, so we're going to
be very careful going out to

106
00:06:21,760 --> 00:06:23,880
work this morning.
Just fingers crossed at this

107
00:06:23,880 --> 00:06:25,800
point.
Yeah, thank you.

108
00:06:25,920 --> 00:06:29,000
BC Yeah.
So you're in Charlotte area.

109
00:06:29,000 --> 00:06:33,400
I'm in western North Carolina.
We got a little bit of snow,

110
00:06:33,400 --> 00:06:37,200
nothing massive, maybe an inch
or two from what I could tell.

111
00:06:37,520 --> 00:06:41,760
And we did get a lot of ice.
Woke up yesterday to a beautiful

112
00:06:41,760 --> 00:06:45,960
shimmering landscape outside my
window.

113
00:06:45,960 --> 00:06:50,840
But that also meant my driveway,
which if you don't remember, I

114
00:06:50,840 --> 00:06:56,000
live on a mountain so I've got a
nice winding long driveway that

115
00:06:56,000 --> 00:06:58,760
heads to the bottom of the
mountain that was also

116
00:06:59,040 --> 00:07:02,760
shimmering with ice.
So we weren't going anywhere

117
00:07:02,760 --> 00:07:03,920
yesterday.
I didn't.

118
00:07:03,920 --> 00:07:09,360
I don't have enough ice melt or
anything else to really, really

119
00:07:09,360 --> 00:07:12,240
take care of the driveway.
But it didn't melt over the day.

120
00:07:12,240 --> 00:07:15,680
But of course, like most of you,
it is freezing cold here.

121
00:07:15,800 --> 00:07:20,760
It's 13° here in this area.
I know there are some areas a

122
00:07:20,760 --> 00:07:23,320
lot colder.
OK, normally we don't spend a

123
00:07:23,320 --> 00:07:25,080
lot of time talking about the
weather, but it was a

124
00:07:25,080 --> 00:07:29,240
significant event here in the US
for about half the country.

125
00:07:29,240 --> 00:07:32,560
I feel like we're at least
bracing for it, maybe not as

126
00:07:32,560 --> 00:07:35,480
affected, but at least bracing
for it.

127
00:07:35,480 --> 00:07:37,920
So I figured let's talk a little
bit about it and make sure the

128
00:07:37,920 --> 00:07:43,760
crew is doing doing OK.
OK, let's dig in to Obsession

129
00:07:43,760 --> 00:07:47,120
Worthy podcasts, usually a
Monday feature, but since we

130
00:07:47,120 --> 00:07:49,600
canceled yesterday, we moved it
to today.

131
00:07:50,000 --> 00:07:53,240
So Jonathan leads the charge
with this.

132
00:07:53,240 --> 00:07:57,040
And I'll let Jonathan first
maybe breakdown the purpose of

133
00:07:57,040 --> 00:08:01,640
Obsession Worthy podcast and
then set us up for what episode

134
00:08:01,640 --> 00:08:03,480
and show we're going to be
discussing today.

135
00:08:03,680 --> 00:08:06,040
Take it away.
The idea behind Obsession Worthy

136
00:08:06,040 --> 00:08:09,360
Podcast is looking at podcasts
and seeing, you know, while we

137
00:08:09,360 --> 00:08:12,640
may not do them exactly the
same, what aspects we can pull

138
00:08:12,640 --> 00:08:16,000
into our own podcast that'll
help us have more Obsession

139
00:08:16,000 --> 00:08:19,680
Worthy Podcast ourselves, do
different things and just be

140
00:08:19,680 --> 00:08:22,840
exposed to what others are doing
on their podcast to learn a

141
00:08:22,840 --> 00:08:24,520
little bit about what's working
and what's not.

142
00:08:24,880 --> 00:08:31,280
And today we're diving into Song
Exploder, the episode 150, I

143
00:08:31,280 --> 00:08:36,280
believe the Fleetwood Mac
episode, which is Go Your Own

144
00:08:36,280 --> 00:08:38,280
Way, and it breaks down that
song.

145
00:08:38,280 --> 00:08:40,880
And we're going to talk about
how that breakdown kind of

146
00:08:40,919 --> 00:08:43,840
builds a story and how you can
build that story in your own

147
00:08:43,840 --> 00:08:46,840
podcast.
I love the song, so I was

148
00:08:46,840 --> 00:08:50,120
excited to see this and I was
excited to see that we were

149
00:08:50,120 --> 00:08:54,000
doing a Song Exploder episode
because I really haven't ever

150
00:08:54,000 --> 00:08:56,800
listened to Song Exploder.
I've seen some stuff because I

151
00:08:56,800 --> 00:08:59,320
think they've had some TV series
as well.

152
00:08:59,320 --> 00:09:02,200
Am I mistaken on that?
No, I believe you're right.

153
00:09:02,200 --> 00:09:04,640
Yeah, I think they did.
I think I saw it on Netflix once

154
00:09:04,640 --> 00:09:06,840
or twice.
But yeah, I was excited to dig

155
00:09:06,840 --> 00:09:08,360
into this and especially this
song.

156
00:09:08,360 --> 00:09:10,600
It's a great song.
And I'm curious because we are

157
00:09:10,600 --> 00:09:14,840
playing clips there are there is
some music, the song playing

158
00:09:14,840 --> 00:09:16,200
from time to time in the
background.

159
00:09:16,200 --> 00:09:19,120
And actually, yeah, you'll hear
more about that in a second.

160
00:09:19,240 --> 00:09:22,600
So we'll see how this goes.
As far as YouTube and the other

161
00:09:22,600 --> 00:09:26,840
platforms, if they allow us to
keep this episode up, we'll see.

162
00:09:28,320 --> 00:09:30,920
Let me go into the concept just
quickly for those that don't

163
00:09:30,920 --> 00:09:32,640
know.
It's very different.

164
00:09:32,640 --> 00:09:36,680
And as a podcast, each episode
kind of takes one track and it

165
00:09:36,680 --> 00:09:39,240
pulls it apart, but not in like
a technical way.

166
00:09:39,240 --> 00:09:41,840
The artist is actually talking
you through like the emotional

167
00:09:41,840 --> 00:09:45,240
decisions, what was going on
behind the work, behind the

168
00:09:45,240 --> 00:09:48,320
scenes and what they were trying
to say, like what worked, what

169
00:09:48,320 --> 00:09:50,400
didn't, what they changed, all
of that.

170
00:09:50,400 --> 00:09:54,520
So it really is a different type
of podcast and it's very

171
00:09:54,600 --> 00:09:57,360
intimate because you're
listening to somebody explain

172
00:09:57,920 --> 00:10:01,800
not just the process, but like
the the reliving, the moment

173
00:10:01,800 --> 00:10:03,320
when everything sort of clicked
in.

174
00:10:03,680 --> 00:10:06,280
So I think that's one of the
things that makes it really,

175
00:10:06,280 --> 00:10:09,320
really powerful.
And the song is the end product,

176
00:10:09,320 --> 00:10:12,920
but the real story is everything
that got us to that point with

177
00:10:12,920 --> 00:10:15,880
that song.
So for today's episode, we're

178
00:10:15,880 --> 00:10:19,720
going to look at how this
podcast builds a story 1st and

179
00:10:19,720 --> 00:10:21,800
how it builds that story with a
unique format.

180
00:10:22,360 --> 00:10:25,040
And then we'll talk about some
of the repeatable obsession

181
00:10:25,040 --> 00:10:29,120
worthy aspects of it.
What they do is they turn the

182
00:10:29,760 --> 00:10:33,360
creation into a narrative arc
that follows this, the stakes.

183
00:10:33,360 --> 00:10:37,440
So why it mattered to them, the
spark What?

184
00:10:37,640 --> 00:10:40,640
Where was the inspiration?
Obviously we have the messy

185
00:10:40,640 --> 00:10:42,640
middle, which is where they're
working on everything, putting

186
00:10:42,640 --> 00:10:45,480
the song together.
The final choice, which is what

187
00:10:46,200 --> 00:10:49,320
brings it to its final state,
and then the payoff, which is

188
00:10:49,320 --> 00:10:53,640
when you hear that final track,
which I will say it actually did

189
00:10:53,640 --> 00:10:56,000
change the way I listen to Go
Your Own Way.

190
00:10:56,000 --> 00:10:59,520
Like when I listen to this and I
listen to it a few times, but it

191
00:10:59,520 --> 00:11:02,160
really does change the way you
listen to the song.

192
00:11:02,720 --> 00:11:06,080
I think that's one of the cool
things about this show, yeah, Is

193
00:11:06,080 --> 00:11:09,280
that we really get to learn
about a song in a whole new way.

194
00:11:09,280 --> 00:11:13,840
And I think it does in fact
change, at least for many and

195
00:11:14,040 --> 00:11:16,920
definitely me.
It does change my perspective of

196
00:11:16,920 --> 00:11:20,720
the song after hearing how it
was created, why it was created,

197
00:11:20,720 --> 00:11:24,040
etcetera.
Mark, I think the first clip is

198
00:11:24,040 --> 00:11:26,880
the setup clip.
Yep, I got it all right.

199
00:11:27,440 --> 00:11:32,880
Here we go.
Lindsey Buckingham is a

200
00:11:32,880 --> 00:11:35,200
singer-songwriter, A guitarist,
and a producer.

201
00:11:35,760 --> 00:11:39,200
In 1974, he joined the band
Fleetwood Mac, along with Stevie

202
00:11:39,200 --> 00:11:40,560
Nicks, his girlfriend at the
time.

203
00:11:41,040 --> 00:11:44,800
A few years later, in 1977,
Fleetwood Mac released the album

204
00:11:44,800 --> 00:11:48,360
Rumours, which would go on to
sell over 40 million copies and

205
00:11:48,360 --> 00:11:50,880
become the eighth highest
selling album in history.

206
00:11:51,400 --> 00:11:54,120
In this episode, Lindsey
Buckingham breaks down Go Your

207
00:11:54,120 --> 00:11:56,800
Own Way, the song that he wrote
for that album about his

208
00:11:56,800 --> 00:12:05,320
relationship with Stevie Nicks.
This is the same intro for

209
00:12:05,320 --> 00:12:08,520
pretty much every episode.
He will, and he actually steps

210
00:12:08,520 --> 00:12:11,520
back after this intro.
That's kind of what he does, and

211
00:12:11,520 --> 00:12:13,800
then the artist takes control of
the episode.

212
00:12:14,200 --> 00:12:17,000
But it's a really simple intro.
It talks quickly about the

213
00:12:17,000 --> 00:12:19,840
premise of the show, what the
song is, and what they're going

214
00:12:19,840 --> 00:12:22,360
to be talking about.
It's clean, consistent, and

215
00:12:22,480 --> 00:12:27,040
easily recognizable.
And the audio on this podcast is

216
00:12:27,120 --> 00:12:29,160
phenomenal as well.
I don't know if we can hear it

217
00:12:29,160 --> 00:12:31,360
as clearly on Clubhouse.
When you say the audio is

218
00:12:31,360 --> 00:12:33,200
phenomenal, you're talking about
the quality.

219
00:12:33,320 --> 00:12:35,400
Yeah, real quick.
I think Sid had something.

220
00:12:35,400 --> 00:12:38,280
Jonathan, let's go to Sid.
I really enjoyed this episode,

221
00:12:38,280 --> 00:12:41,200
Jonathan, and I'm a huge
Fleetwood Mac fan.

222
00:12:41,200 --> 00:12:44,200
Of course, I've ripped in the
80s so that makes sense.

223
00:12:44,560 --> 00:12:47,520
A huge Stevie Nicks fan.
So it was really great to hear

224
00:12:47,520 --> 00:12:49,720
the story and I love the setup
of this.

225
00:12:49,720 --> 00:12:53,240
I mean he clearly tells you what
to expect and then he just goes

226
00:12:53,240 --> 00:12:57,360
away.
So I am curious though, like how

227
00:12:57,360 --> 00:13:00,280
did he do you know how he pulled
all the clips or were those

228
00:13:00,280 --> 00:13:03,080
people like given questions to
ask?

229
00:13:03,080 --> 00:13:06,240
Or I mean I'm just curious about
how he actually created the

230
00:13:06,240 --> 00:13:09,320
episode when he sets it up and
then he goes away.

231
00:13:09,600 --> 00:13:13,280
Any ideas?
I believe the way that he does

232
00:13:13,280 --> 00:13:18,840
it is he does kind of set the
tone for them, but he handles

233
00:13:18,840 --> 00:13:21,440
all all the connections in the
back end.

234
00:13:21,440 --> 00:13:25,880
So he will probably, he probably
has questions that are asked.

235
00:13:26,320 --> 00:13:30,400
So he's actually interviewing
the people, it's just he's not

236
00:13:30,400 --> 00:13:31,960
making himself present.
That's.

237
00:13:31,960 --> 00:13:35,680
How I understood it, Ashley
threw something is that would I

238
00:13:35,680 --> 00:13:37,000
get it right?
You threw me 100.

239
00:13:37,120 --> 00:13:40,560
I think I saw another show that
was talking about the production

240
00:13:40,560 --> 00:13:44,240
of this show where he explains
that he essentially interviews

241
00:13:44,240 --> 00:13:48,840
the subject matter and then
edits himself out, but does a

242
00:13:48,840 --> 00:13:51,080
great job of asking those
leading question.

243
00:13:51,680 --> 00:13:56,040
I can only imagine how much the
length of the recording and the

244
00:13:56,040 --> 00:14:00,240
amount of editing to get this
story, the way the story is told

245
00:14:00,240 --> 00:14:05,480
in 22 minutes, that's probably
an hour or two worth of like

246
00:14:05,480 --> 00:14:09,280
content that he's got to filter
through to create the story the

247
00:14:09,280 --> 00:14:11,640
way the story was created.
So that in itself, I think,

248
00:14:11,640 --> 00:14:14,040
would be considered an art.
Oh yeah.

249
00:14:14,040 --> 00:14:17,480
And you know, content editing is
an art and it's, it can be

250
00:14:17,480 --> 00:14:19,640
challenging.
You know, I'm working with a

251
00:14:19,640 --> 00:14:23,080
client right now who's starting
a podcast.

252
00:14:23,080 --> 00:14:26,880
He's and he's been recording
interviews and each of his

253
00:14:26,880 --> 00:14:29,600
interviews, you know, we're
trying to get the these episodes

254
00:14:29,600 --> 00:14:33,880
down to under an hour,
preferably 30 to 45 minutes if

255
00:14:34,000 --> 00:14:36,760
if possible.
But he's giving us like 4 hours

256
00:14:36,760 --> 00:14:40,040
worth of content.
So it is a real challenge to

257
00:14:40,040 --> 00:14:44,600
have to go through lots and lots
of material and find the right

258
00:14:44,600 --> 00:14:47,920
ones that really help you tell
your story.

259
00:14:47,920 --> 00:14:52,320
But I do think, yes, it's an art
and I do think it's something

260
00:14:52,320 --> 00:14:56,560
that would be beneficial for
more people to do because it's

261
00:14:56,560 --> 00:14:59,120
not done so much.
But I think it just gives us a

262
00:14:59,120 --> 00:15:03,800
different way of listening and
enjoying a podcast, you know,

263
00:15:03,800 --> 00:15:06,400
with the it's true storytelling,
right?

264
00:15:06,400 --> 00:15:09,120
It's not just a quote UN quote,
just a conversation.

265
00:15:09,560 --> 00:15:15,160
This is a really thoughtful,
well produced podcast and and I

266
00:15:15,160 --> 00:15:18,560
think we can learn from that I.
Think BC had thrown a pepper.

267
00:15:18,880 --> 00:15:21,080
All right, and for those who
don't know what we're talking

268
00:15:21,080 --> 00:15:24,280
about, he isn't literally
throwing pepper across the room.

269
00:15:24,840 --> 00:15:26,680
That's an emoji to get our
attention.

270
00:15:26,680 --> 00:15:28,160
So we know somebody wants to
chime in.

271
00:15:28,160 --> 00:15:30,480
Go ahead BC.
Give us some time.

272
00:15:30,480 --> 00:15:32,280
We'll we'll get there literally
at some point.

273
00:15:32,880 --> 00:15:35,200
So going back to the quality
that Jonathan was talking about,

274
00:15:35,440 --> 00:15:38,640
it really is just so crisp and
clear.

275
00:15:38,640 --> 00:15:41,280
And this is, I thought about
kind of going back a little bit

276
00:15:41,280 --> 00:15:45,560
to last week's analysis where
this guy really knows how to

277
00:15:45,560 --> 00:15:48,640
place himself in a good cadence.
He gets a lot of bang for his

278
00:15:48,640 --> 00:15:51,200
buck.
He's really relaxed as well.

279
00:15:51,200 --> 00:15:54,280
He's got a great flow, great
inflection with his voice.

280
00:15:54,640 --> 00:15:57,000
And it took me a while to
realize this is one of the first

281
00:15:57,000 --> 00:16:00,720
times I didn't mind that the
actual lead up into the meat of

282
00:16:00,720 --> 00:16:03,720
the episode was several minutes
long.

283
00:16:03,720 --> 00:16:07,200
And correct me if I'm wrong,
Jonathan, I listed last night,

284
00:16:07,200 --> 00:16:11,320
but he has the kind of a he's
got the intro.

285
00:16:11,320 --> 00:16:12,720
He talks about the premise of
the show.

286
00:16:13,000 --> 00:16:16,400
He then has a bit of a scripted
story leading into a promotional

287
00:16:16,400 --> 00:16:18,720
bit for the sponsor of the
episode.

288
00:16:19,080 --> 00:16:23,920
And then after all that, he gets
into the actual this is the song

289
00:16:23,920 --> 00:16:26,400
about this episode.
His this is the background and

290
00:16:26,400 --> 00:16:30,240
then gets to the meet and
because that quality and that

291
00:16:30,240 --> 00:16:33,640
flow is just so nice, I did not
mind that it took us a while to

292
00:16:33,640 --> 00:16:36,960
get there and I found that as a
really nice surprise.

293
00:16:37,600 --> 00:16:39,920
This could be a whole
conversation in itself, right?

294
00:16:39,920 --> 00:16:44,240
Because a lot of times we
encourage podcasters to get

295
00:16:44,240 --> 00:16:46,920
right to it, right?
No big build up.

296
00:16:46,920 --> 00:16:51,880
Don't take 5 minutes or more to
get into the episode, Just get

297
00:16:51,880 --> 00:16:54,360
into it right and give a short
intro.

298
00:16:54,600 --> 00:16:57,880
I do think that in some cases
you have to take that with a

299
00:16:57,880 --> 00:17:02,160
grain of salt because I think
we're often giving that advice

300
00:17:02,440 --> 00:17:06,040
to people who are newer to
podcasting, right?

301
00:17:06,040 --> 00:17:09,440
And and that's because what I
often find is that a new

302
00:17:09,440 --> 00:17:15,000
podcaster can sometimes create a
long drawn out introduction for

303
00:17:15,000 --> 00:17:19,160
the episode with unnecessary
discussion, unnecessary points.

304
00:17:19,599 --> 00:17:22,280
And it just feels a little too
long, right?

305
00:17:22,280 --> 00:17:25,119
But when you know what you're
doing after some time and you

306
00:17:25,119 --> 00:17:28,359
really take some time to learn
production and production value,

307
00:17:29,000 --> 00:17:32,160
then I think, you know, if you
know what you're doing, those

308
00:17:32,320 --> 00:17:36,480
intros can last a little longer.
Because to BC's point, it kept

309
00:17:36,480 --> 00:17:38,040
his interest all the way
through.

310
00:17:38,040 --> 00:17:41,720
And that's really the ultimate
goal, right, Was to keep

311
00:17:41,760 --> 00:17:44,840
people's interests.
That's what keeps them stick,

312
00:17:45,120 --> 00:17:48,240
keeps them on the episode,
listening all the way through,

313
00:17:48,240 --> 00:17:50,880
if you can keep their attention
and interest.

314
00:17:51,120 --> 00:17:52,560
Ralph, did you have something or
was that?

315
00:17:52,560 --> 00:17:53,720
Yeah, it was you, Ralph.
Go ahead.

316
00:17:53,760 --> 00:17:55,200
I was just going to say the
other thing.

317
00:17:55,200 --> 00:17:57,480
I think the reason you can get
away with that, Mark, is I think

318
00:17:57,480 --> 00:18:01,040
it's an expectation because we
understand the high

319
00:18:01,040 --> 00:18:04,720
professionalism of this podcast.
And it's sort of one of those

320
00:18:04,720 --> 00:18:07,080
things you could you just expect
that there's going to be some

321
00:18:07,080 --> 00:18:08,600
commercials at the front end of
this.

322
00:18:08,920 --> 00:18:12,440
And I think that that goes along
because it's commercialized.

323
00:18:12,920 --> 00:18:15,720
Yeah, that makes sense too.
And I think that you could also

324
00:18:15,720 --> 00:18:19,560
make a case that the audience of
this particular episode, they're

325
00:18:19,560 --> 00:18:23,920
interested in the content.
They're probably fans of

326
00:18:23,920 --> 00:18:27,080
Fleetwood Mac, right.
So the build up is just building

327
00:18:27,080 --> 00:18:29,600
anticipation, excitement,
etcetera.

328
00:18:30,080 --> 00:18:32,760
And if you're thinking, well,
I'm never going to do a a

329
00:18:32,760 --> 00:18:35,720
podcast about Fleetwood Mac or
one of their songs.

330
00:18:35,720 --> 00:18:39,600
Well, true.
And you have your own niche and

331
00:18:39,600 --> 00:18:43,840
I'm sure you can bring in
someone or something special

332
00:18:43,840 --> 00:18:46,920
that your audience would
anticipate would be interested

333
00:18:46,920 --> 00:18:49,120
in hearing.
It's just a matter of how you

334
00:18:49,120 --> 00:18:53,160
frame it and and what you're
framing for your audience.

335
00:18:53,160 --> 00:18:56,520
If it's something of interest to
them, that is their Fleetwood

336
00:18:56,520 --> 00:19:00,680
Mac that that is their go your
own way, right?

337
00:19:00,680 --> 00:19:03,440
If you're specifically talking
about something that's of

338
00:19:03,440 --> 00:19:07,040
interest to that niche, I hope
that makes sense.

339
00:19:07,120 --> 00:19:10,480
But Jonathan, take it away.
The other thing I will add is

340
00:19:10,480 --> 00:19:13,480
there are 354 episodes.
This is 150.

341
00:19:13,960 --> 00:19:16,240
He's gotten it down pretty down
pat.

342
00:19:16,240 --> 00:19:19,640
I'm guessing with 354 episodes
of Song Exploder.

343
00:19:20,040 --> 00:19:22,400
That's a lot of editing.
Just imagine that too.

344
00:19:22,640 --> 00:19:26,840
We will see now that Lindsay
Buckingham is going to take over

345
00:19:26,840 --> 00:19:30,520
the narration of the episode and
he begins to build this story

346
00:19:30,520 --> 00:19:33,840
arc in his own unique way that
tells the story of go your own

347
00:19:33,840 --> 00:19:36,760
way.
So the origin moment, Mick

348
00:19:36,760 --> 00:19:39,520
Fleetwood hears Frozen Love,
which is a song that him and

349
00:19:39,520 --> 00:19:44,360
Stevie Nicks had done in their
previous endeavor as a band and

350
00:19:44,360 --> 00:19:46,720
he calls and asked Lindsay to
join the band.

351
00:19:47,200 --> 00:19:49,280
Lindsay says, well, you'll have
to take my girlfriend too.

352
00:19:49,800 --> 00:19:51,640
Obviously the girlfriend was
Stevie Nicks.

353
00:19:51,840 --> 00:19:56,760
So that's how they ended up as
Fleetwood Mac, and it's really

354
00:19:56,760 --> 00:19:59,200
setting the stakes for why the
song mattered to them.

355
00:19:59,760 --> 00:20:03,360
And that's kind of what the clip
is that follows, which is the

356
00:20:03,440 --> 00:20:06,480
second clip.
Written almost as a stream of

357
00:20:06,480 --> 00:20:12,160
consciousness, I was just
chunking away on those chords

358
00:20:12,160 --> 00:20:14,280
and coming up with the lyrics to
go with it.

359
00:20:14,880 --> 00:20:19,560
Loving you isn't the right thing
to do.

360
00:20:21,240 --> 00:20:23,840
If you start with the first
lyric, loving you isn't the

361
00:20:23,840 --> 00:20:26,080
right thing to do.
It sounds like you're beginning

362
00:20:26,080 --> 00:20:29,800
a conversation with someone.
There was nothing about it that

363
00:20:29,800 --> 00:20:32,840
was thought out.
It was just the raw expression

364
00:20:32,840 --> 00:20:39,600
of the emotion behind the song.
How can I ever change things

365
00:20:39,600 --> 00:20:44,240
that I feel?
I sort of was coming to terms

366
00:20:44,240 --> 00:20:48,680
with the fact that I may not be
over this person and at the same

367
00:20:48,680 --> 00:20:53,920
time I'm aware that I've got to
accept what's happened and move

368
00:20:53,920 --> 00:20:57,600
on.
Right from the onset of the

369
00:20:57,600 --> 00:20:59,320
episode, we're not even 5
minutes in yet.

370
00:20:59,760 --> 00:21:03,400
And from the onset of the song
you are flushed with emotion.

371
00:21:03,520 --> 00:21:07,600
It is like, OK, wow.
I just sit there and go.

372
00:21:07,880 --> 00:21:11,760
I can't imagine breaking up with
somebody, still being in love

373
00:21:11,760 --> 00:21:14,480
with them and having to write a
song about it that they're going

374
00:21:14,480 --> 00:21:18,720
to sing with me.
That's an interesting, that's an

375
00:21:18,720 --> 00:21:21,120
interesting setup.
From the moment it starts,

376
00:21:21,120 --> 00:21:22,640
loving you isn't the right thing
to do.

377
00:21:23,000 --> 00:21:26,800
And then he talks about how
there was a whole bunch of

378
00:21:26,800 --> 00:21:30,680
people that were getting split
up as part of the band and you

379
00:21:30,680 --> 00:21:33,160
know, how it was written as just
a stream of consciousness and

380
00:21:33,160 --> 00:21:37,800
the emotions were poured into
that particular, you know, that

381
00:21:37,800 --> 00:21:42,080
particular song.
So the emotions are raw, real. 5

382
00:21:42,080 --> 00:21:44,600
minutes into the podcast and
you're like, OK, this song has

383
00:21:44,600 --> 00:21:48,280
real meaning behind it.
And as I always say, stories are

384
00:21:48,280 --> 00:21:51,480
driven by universal emotions,
and heartbreak is a big,

385
00:21:51,480 --> 00:21:55,120
powerful one.
And I was just thinking, all of

386
00:21:55,120 --> 00:21:57,920
us are going to probably be
walking around the rest of the

387
00:21:57,920 --> 00:22:01,760
day humming go your own way.
I think it's going to be an ear

388
00:22:01,760 --> 00:22:04,520
worm now for the rest of the day
for many of us.

389
00:22:05,440 --> 00:22:09,800
Yep, I'm sure it will be.
Welcome to the podcasting

390
00:22:09,800 --> 00:22:13,360
morning chat this morning.
Yeah, he caps off that emotional

391
00:22:13,360 --> 00:22:16,520
start by further explaining,
like, the status of things

392
00:22:16,520 --> 00:22:18,840
during rumors.
He'd broken up with Stevie.

393
00:22:18,840 --> 00:22:22,000
John and Christine McVeigh, who
had been married, were broken

394
00:22:22,000 --> 00:22:24,080
up.
So it was really an exercise of

395
00:22:24,080 --> 00:22:26,840
how you compartmentalize your
life and everything that's going

396
00:22:26,840 --> 00:22:30,920
on in it because they were all
going through going through it

397
00:22:30,960 --> 00:22:33,640
while still.
And I think three of them were

398
00:22:33,640 --> 00:22:37,000
writing this song together.
The three that were going

399
00:22:37,000 --> 00:22:39,760
through, you know, the divorces
and the breakups and all that

400
00:22:40,160 --> 00:22:43,760
were writing the song together.
So that's sort of the kick off

401
00:22:43,760 --> 00:22:46,680
to the messy middle.
It was messy doing this song,

402
00:22:47,120 --> 00:22:49,520
and then we talk about the
different layers and the

403
00:22:49,520 --> 00:22:51,880
textures in the song that
they're putting together and

404
00:22:51,880 --> 00:22:55,000
what was working, what wasn't
working and things like that.

405
00:22:55,600 --> 00:22:58,440
So that's building the spark,
the reason why they song was

406
00:22:58,440 --> 00:23:00,160
important, why it mattered to
them.

407
00:23:00,400 --> 00:23:03,120
Now we're going into how to act
the things they had to figure

408
00:23:03,120 --> 00:23:05,240
out.
So that's the next.

409
00:23:05,240 --> 00:23:07,560
One, and that's clip 3.
All right, here we go.

410
00:23:11,720 --> 00:23:14,760
I said Nick.
I think this pattern going from

411
00:23:14,760 --> 00:23:18,720
snare to Tom snare to Tom not in
the chorus but in the verses

412
00:23:18,720 --> 00:23:24,720
would be just great.
But Mick is someone who he's

413
00:23:24,720 --> 00:23:29,320
playing strictly from the heart
and from the gut, and as such,

414
00:23:29,400 --> 00:23:32,640
he just has to do what feels
right to him.

415
00:23:33,120 --> 00:23:36,320
So when I showed him the
pattern, he couldn't actually

416
00:23:36,320 --> 00:23:39,520
play it.
And finally, I'm just saying to

417
00:23:39,520 --> 00:23:42,840
him, look, I mean, is there a
way you can paraphrase that to

418
00:23:42,840 --> 00:23:45,520
make it your own?
Which he does.

419
00:23:50,000 --> 00:23:53,320
He opens up the kick and it
keeps A-44 going on it.

420
00:23:53,320 --> 00:23:56,960
And instead of going from snare
to Tom, which felt wrong to him,

421
00:23:56,960 --> 00:24:01,640
he's playing the Tom across the
beat and letting the kick drum

422
00:24:01,640 --> 00:24:06,200
be the middle beat.
The details of this song are

423
00:24:06,200 --> 00:24:12,360
becoming the meat of the of the
podcast and very small details.

424
00:24:12,480 --> 00:24:16,760
I would not have listened to the
drum pattern that is in Go Your

425
00:24:16,760 --> 00:24:19,920
Own Way and The Rolling Stones
song quite the same way.

426
00:24:20,200 --> 00:24:24,840
But those small details are
becoming part of the whole story

427
00:24:25,160 --> 00:24:30,800
as and those pieces are actually
supporting, supported by what

428
00:24:31,000 --> 00:24:32,800
you know, the clips that are
being played.

429
00:24:33,320 --> 00:24:36,400
Even these little details make a
compelling story.

430
00:24:36,760 --> 00:24:38,880
Does anybody have any?
Yeah, I'm curious what's going

431
00:24:38,880 --> 00:24:41,200
on in the chat here.
I see Ashley saying something

432
00:24:41,200 --> 00:24:44,800
about that being her favorite
part in BC chiming in.

433
00:24:44,800 --> 00:24:46,080
Fill us in.
Thank you.

434
00:24:46,320 --> 00:24:51,200
So what I loved about this part
is I believe it gives non

435
00:24:51,200 --> 00:24:55,320
musicians a way to listen to
music in a way they might not

436
00:24:55,320 --> 00:24:57,920
already.
As a musician, when I listen to

437
00:24:57,920 --> 00:25:01,640
music, sometimes I'll tell
myself before I listen, OK, I'm

438
00:25:01,640 --> 00:25:04,560
only gonna listen to the bass or
I'm only gonna listen to the

439
00:25:04,560 --> 00:25:08,840
drums or what have you.
So what I like about this part

440
00:25:08,920 --> 00:25:12,880
of the podcast is that they
break down the stems and they

441
00:25:12,880 --> 00:25:17,200
demonstrate those creative
decisions that amounted to the

442
00:25:17,200 --> 00:25:20,320
finished product.
And I love how they go back and

443
00:25:20,320 --> 00:25:24,200
say, hey, I wanted you to.
He wanted Nick Fleetwood to play

444
00:25:24,200 --> 00:25:28,800
the drums like someone inspired
by that Rolling Stones track,

445
00:25:29,120 --> 00:25:31,640
but he wasn't able to play it.
So they ended up doing their own

446
00:25:31,640 --> 00:25:35,720
paraphrase thing with it, and
that ended up being a big part

447
00:25:35,720 --> 00:25:38,440
of the song.
So I really love that part of

448
00:25:38,440 --> 00:25:40,280
the podcast for breaking it down
in that way.

449
00:25:40,880 --> 00:25:43,160
Yeah, that's interesting.
And I, it's cool to have a

450
00:25:43,160 --> 00:25:45,920
musician on stage to call
something like that out.

451
00:25:45,920 --> 00:25:47,480
I do that.
I do that a lot.

452
00:25:47,480 --> 00:25:51,240
And I'm not a musician, at least
not a trained 1.

453
00:25:51,240 --> 00:25:54,560
I I certainly have the bug but I
don't really do much with it.

454
00:25:54,560 --> 00:25:57,240
But I tend to listen, especially
with harmonies.

455
00:25:57,440 --> 00:26:00,280
I like to listen to the
different harmonies and try to 0

456
00:26:00,280 --> 00:26:03,000
in and hear that particular
part.

457
00:26:03,000 --> 00:26:06,520
But like again, I'm not a
musician so I don't even know

458
00:26:06,840 --> 00:26:10,160
what to call each of the
different harmonies but I do

459
00:26:10,160 --> 00:26:13,120
listen for them.
It's fascinating to me BC did

460
00:26:13,120 --> 00:26:15,080
you want to chime in?
Much of what Ashley was saying,

461
00:26:15,080 --> 00:26:17,440
this is just a great way to
really revolutionize the

462
00:26:17,440 --> 00:26:20,360
experience of even what's been a
long time.

463
00:26:20,400 --> 00:26:21,800
You know, this is not a recent
song.

464
00:26:21,800 --> 00:26:24,120
This has been out for a couple
decades and I think this is a

465
00:26:24,120 --> 00:26:29,520
great way to really expand upon
the experience for musicians and

466
00:26:29,520 --> 00:26:32,360
non musicians alike.
What I was singing The Shadow,

467
00:26:32,800 --> 00:26:35,080
this part talking about the same
thing was one of my favorite

468
00:26:35,080 --> 00:26:38,600
parts but then another and I
don't want to give too much

469
00:26:38,600 --> 00:26:41,440
assuming it might be another one
of the segments here or another.

470
00:26:41,440 --> 00:26:45,040
One of the clips is when they
discuss the lyrics and how

471
00:26:45,360 --> 00:26:49,680
Stevie played into giving the
more verbal aspect of the song.

472
00:26:49,920 --> 00:26:53,040
Yeah, thank you BC and I
appreciate you guys chatting a

473
00:26:53,040 --> 00:26:56,400
little bit in the chat about it.
That helps me know who to go to,

474
00:26:56,400 --> 00:26:59,760
but feel free to chime in on
stage as well with all of this

475
00:26:59,760 --> 00:27:01,400
feedback.
This is good stuff.

476
00:27:01,400 --> 00:27:03,560
Thank you, Sid.
Go for it.

477
00:27:03,760 --> 00:27:07,440
One of the things I liked about
this show was how it did give

478
00:27:07,440 --> 00:27:11,880
those of us that are not
musicians an inside look at to

479
00:27:12,200 --> 00:27:16,000
at how songs are created.
Like what's the creative process

480
00:27:16,000 --> 00:27:17,880
that they go through?
How did they come up with the

481
00:27:17,880 --> 00:27:19,520
lyrics?
The meaning behind this

482
00:27:19,520 --> 00:27:22,800
particular song is as we talk
about the different stems and

483
00:27:22,800 --> 00:27:25,520
which I it's a new term to me
and the drums.

484
00:27:25,520 --> 00:27:28,640
And I mean it just gives you
this really inside look at how

485
00:27:28,640 --> 00:27:31,840
these songs are created and the
creativity that goes along with

486
00:27:31,840 --> 00:27:34,920
it that musicians don't just
some of them do, but don't just

487
00:27:34,920 --> 00:27:37,160
sit down and come up with a with
a song.

488
00:27:37,160 --> 00:27:40,360
So I really enjoyed that aspect
of getting a behind the scenes

489
00:27:40,360 --> 00:27:45,080
look of how these were created.
Now, Sid, I know this doesn't

490
00:27:45,080 --> 00:27:49,920
feel like comparing apples to
apples, but theoretically, I

491
00:27:49,920 --> 00:27:51,640
mean, could you do something
like that?

492
00:27:51,640 --> 00:27:53,600
Could you?
And I know all the work

493
00:27:53,600 --> 00:27:55,920
involved, you already called
that out, but let's just pretend

494
00:27:55,920 --> 00:27:59,240
for a minute that it isn't a lot
of work, or maybe someone else

495
00:27:59,240 --> 00:28:01,760
is doing it for you.
Could you do something like that

496
00:28:01,760 --> 00:28:05,200
in the office furniture space?
Yeah, absolutely.

497
00:28:05,200 --> 00:28:08,000
We could.
We could talk about the process

498
00:28:08,000 --> 00:28:11,320
of designing a new product
because you know, when you see a

499
00:28:11,320 --> 00:28:13,720
piece of furniture like, oh,
well, that's really great.

500
00:28:13,720 --> 00:28:16,400
What you don't realize is that a
piece of furniture takes

501
00:28:16,640 --> 00:28:21,440
anywhere between 18 and 24
months from the time it is

502
00:28:21,440 --> 00:28:24,160
conceptualized to the time it's
available to market, in some

503
00:28:24,160 --> 00:28:26,600
cases even longer than that.
There are companies that spend

504
00:28:26,600 --> 00:28:29,600
years working on product
development, so you could

505
00:28:29,600 --> 00:28:32,160
definitely tell a story about
product development and

506
00:28:32,160 --> 00:28:35,680
conceptualizing with the
designer, what they go through,

507
00:28:35,680 --> 00:28:38,880
the testing that they go through
and be testing, meaning getting

508
00:28:38,880 --> 00:28:41,720
IT feedback from architects and
designers.

509
00:28:41,720 --> 00:28:44,200
And yeah, there's a whole
process here that could be

510
00:28:44,200 --> 00:28:47,800
broken down in a story like this
about how products come to

511
00:28:47,800 --> 00:28:49,400
market.
It's a great idea, actually.

512
00:28:49,400 --> 00:28:51,800
Yeah, I feel like it is,
especially because you know,

513
00:28:51,800 --> 00:28:55,120
when you hear, yeah, this
episode's going to be about how

514
00:28:55,560 --> 00:28:58,160
a how a piece of office
furniture was created, you may

515
00:28:58,160 --> 00:29:01,040
cock your head and say, well,
OK, right.

516
00:29:01,040 --> 00:29:04,200
But if you're doing it in a way
similar to how Song Exploder

517
00:29:04,200 --> 00:29:06,640
does it, there's something
interesting about that.

518
00:29:06,920 --> 00:29:10,800
Really learning those behind the
scenes, the messiness, getting

519
00:29:10,800 --> 00:29:13,960
from concept to production, that
kind of thing.

520
00:29:13,960 --> 00:29:16,160
I think that there could be
something really interesting

521
00:29:16,280 --> 00:29:18,040
there.
Absolutely.

522
00:29:18,040 --> 00:29:22,880
And Ashley Sid brought up stems,
and that's a new term to him.

523
00:29:22,880 --> 00:29:24,320
And I saw you define it in the
chat.

524
00:29:24,320 --> 00:29:25,920
Will you define it for the rest
of us?

525
00:29:26,440 --> 00:29:29,400
It's just the individual parts
of the song that make up the

526
00:29:29,400 --> 00:29:33,600
whole thing heard separately.
So theoretically, is that that's

527
00:29:33,600 --> 00:29:37,920
similar in podcasting terms?
It's similar to having separate

528
00:29:37,920 --> 00:29:39,920
tracks, right?
If you had three people on the

529
00:29:39,920 --> 00:29:43,000
show and each of them had their
own recording, would that

530
00:29:43,400 --> 00:29:46,840
technically be a STEM?
Yeah, each one would be a step.

531
00:29:46,840 --> 00:29:48,240
OK.
Yeah, that makes sense.

532
00:29:48,240 --> 00:29:50,040
OK, cool.
All right, Jonathan, take it

533
00:29:50,040 --> 00:29:52,840
away.
And Sid was the furniture thing.

534
00:29:52,840 --> 00:29:55,880
I'm reminded of the scene in
Devil Wears Prada where the you

535
00:29:55,880 --> 00:29:59,320
know how the blue sweater got to
the bottom of the bargain bin?

536
00:30:00,800 --> 00:30:03,400
I'm curious, Sid, did you see
that movie and do you know the

537
00:30:03,400 --> 00:30:04,680
reference?
I figured.

538
00:30:05,400 --> 00:30:08,760
Yeah, I figured you'll have to
all get it for you.

539
00:30:09,160 --> 00:30:11,840
This is kind of as we're in the
messy middle, What Sid said is,

540
00:30:11,840 --> 00:30:14,240
you know, gives you that deep
inside view of how a song is put

541
00:30:14,240 --> 00:30:16,880
together.
And that's really cool for those

542
00:30:16,880 --> 00:30:18,720
of us who don't ever get to see
that.

543
00:30:19,120 --> 00:30:22,280
And then we continue to get the
story, the deep, emotional story

544
00:30:22,280 --> 00:30:25,000
of what's happening behind the
scenes as he explores the

545
00:30:25,000 --> 00:30:28,280
vocals, the organ, and the
desire for the song to be

546
00:30:28,280 --> 00:30:31,320
slightly more raw and direct in
the next clips.

547
00:30:31,560 --> 00:30:41,660
So #4.
Christine played the organ.

548
00:30:44,660 --> 00:30:51,020
It was clearly a guitar song and
I was not wanting her piano

549
00:30:51,020 --> 00:30:54,260
textures and her weaving around
that.

550
00:30:54,260 --> 00:30:58,340
She could do so beautifully.
I just wanted to keep it very

551
00:30:58,340 --> 00:31:05,520
direct.
You can go your own way, go your

552
00:31:06,120 --> 00:31:11,480
own way.
You can call it another lonely

553
00:31:11,480 --> 00:31:16,080
day.
There's a lot of oomph behind

554
00:31:16,080 --> 00:31:20,080
the lead vocal and go your own
way because there was a lot of

555
00:31:20,360 --> 00:31:22,800
resolve behind the subject
matter.

556
00:31:23,200 --> 00:31:27,240
I was feeling a lot of that
subject matter as being

557
00:31:27,240 --> 00:31:32,040
something I was living and so it
was a bit cathartic.

558
00:31:32,520 --> 00:31:36,000
We kind of go through and he
talks a little bit about some of

559
00:31:36,000 --> 00:31:39,320
the things that went that Stevie
went through as a child, some

560
00:31:39,320 --> 00:31:41,160
things that they were going
through in the moment.

561
00:31:41,400 --> 00:31:44,040
One of the things that he says
is the the lying.

562
00:31:44,840 --> 00:31:47,320
You can go your own way.
You can call it another lonely

563
00:31:47,320 --> 00:31:52,920
day is because Stevie often kind
of had this rhythm of life where

564
00:31:52,920 --> 00:31:56,800
she would get bored being in
this one place for so long.

565
00:31:56,920 --> 00:31:59,960
So she'd always want to move and
go her own way.

566
00:32:00,400 --> 00:32:04,440
Obviously led to loneliness.
So that was one of the things

567
00:32:04,440 --> 00:32:06,240
that he mentioned in the
episode.

568
00:32:06,240 --> 00:32:08,560
And it was that one hit a little
hard.

569
00:32:09,200 --> 00:32:12,040
You know, that's like, oh man,
just the way that she grew up

570
00:32:12,040 --> 00:32:15,480
and that's the way it went.
And then we hit the acoustic

571
00:32:15,480 --> 00:32:18,880
guitar moment, which the
acoustic guitar almost didn't

572
00:32:18,880 --> 00:32:23,400
make it into the into the song,
but they were living with the

573
00:32:23,400 --> 00:32:27,240
song for a while and listening
to the song and it felt a little

574
00:32:27,240 --> 00:32:30,600
bit off balance.
So the tension that's created by

575
00:32:30,600 --> 00:32:34,400
the vocals is kind of balanced
out by the guitar as a response.

576
00:32:34,960 --> 00:32:39,840
But it created this really
interesting balance and some

577
00:32:39,840 --> 00:32:42,880
disorientation.
And we'll see the resolution

578
00:32:42,880 --> 00:32:46,320
that in the final clip, but
that's really leads into the big

579
00:32:46,320 --> 00:32:49,320
payoff of the song.
So as you can see, we kind of go

580
00:32:49,320 --> 00:32:54,960
through the the story from start
to finish in a unique way with

581
00:32:54,960 --> 00:32:57,640
this podcast, but.
I think BC has something

582
00:32:57,680 --> 00:32:59,040
Jonathan.
Okay, awesome.

583
00:32:59,040 --> 00:33:01,240
Go ahead BC I.
Just wanted to mention a tiny

584
00:33:01,240 --> 00:33:04,000
caveat with Stevies part in the
lyrics here.

585
00:33:04,000 --> 00:33:07,360
If I recall from the story and
what I found pretty compelling

586
00:33:07,360 --> 00:33:11,000
about her perspective on this as
well, is that the reason she

587
00:33:11,320 --> 00:33:14,680
grew up or eventually kind of
grew into this person who didn't

588
00:33:14,680 --> 00:33:17,720
like to stay planted for too
long and wanted to constantly

589
00:33:17,720 --> 00:33:20,800
shift is because her.
It was mentioned her father was

590
00:33:20,800 --> 00:33:24,160
always changing or losing jobs
and therefore she as a child

591
00:33:24,160 --> 00:33:27,600
always had to shift around.
And so she never grew up with

592
00:33:27,600 --> 00:33:32,200
that understanding or perception
of rooting somewhere and having

593
00:33:32,200 --> 00:33:35,080
to always be essentially
prepared to be on the move.

594
00:33:35,080 --> 00:33:38,840
And so that translated to her
adulthood as not wanting to be

595
00:33:38,840 --> 00:33:41,680
anywhere for too long.
Thank you BC appreciate that.

596
00:33:41,720 --> 00:33:44,080
And Jonathan, you want me to go
to the next clip?

597
00:33:44,480 --> 00:33:45,560
Yeah, we can go to the next
clip.

598
00:33:45,560 --> 00:33:48,160
It'll wrap it up pretty nicely.
OK, here we go.

599
00:33:48,160 --> 00:33:52,200
The new Fleetwood Mac single, he
takes a beat, he goes, I don't

600
00:33:52,200 --> 00:33:57,240
know about that one.
And I was able to call up the

601
00:33:57,240 --> 00:34:01,040
station in that moment after
hearing that and be put through

602
00:34:01,040 --> 00:34:03,920
to be Mitchell Reese while a
song was on.

603
00:34:04,280 --> 00:34:06,080
And, you know, he got on the
phone.

604
00:34:06,080 --> 00:34:09,239
I said, hey, B, this is Lindsey
Buckingham here.

605
00:34:09,400 --> 00:34:12,560
Oh, hi, Lindsey.
You just played my song Go Your

606
00:34:12,560 --> 00:34:14,360
Own Way, and you said you
weren't sure about it.

607
00:34:14,360 --> 00:34:16,280
What what What didn't you like
about it?

608
00:34:16,280 --> 00:34:18,639
He's saying, well, you know, I
couldn't find the beat.

609
00:34:19,880 --> 00:34:23,520
I mean, oh, OK.
I mean, that was an element to

610
00:34:23,520 --> 00:34:26,360
go your own way.
But obviously, it didn't make

611
00:34:26,360 --> 00:34:30,199
any difference in the long run.
I was proud of what I was

612
00:34:30,199 --> 00:34:32,960
hearing on the radio and that's
all that mattered.

613
00:34:35,639 --> 00:34:38,960
That guitar and the vocals being
a little bit off it.

614
00:34:38,960 --> 00:34:45,080
It did when you really the beat
is hard to find, but he was

615
00:34:45,080 --> 00:34:48,320
happy with it anyway.
There was, you know, this drama

616
00:34:48,320 --> 00:34:51,440
about whether it was going to go
over well, it didn't matter, but

617
00:34:51,440 --> 00:34:53,159
did make a difference for the
song in the long run.

618
00:34:53,159 --> 00:34:56,280
And he was proud of what he was
hearing, which brings us to that

619
00:34:56,280 --> 00:35:00,440
resolution in the story overall.
So I loved how they brought in

620
00:35:00,440 --> 00:35:04,760
some of the, you know, unsure
about how the song was going to

621
00:35:04,760 --> 00:35:06,480
go.
This they lived with it for a

622
00:35:06,480 --> 00:35:08,560
while.
They added the acoustic guitar

623
00:35:08,760 --> 00:35:12,240
and in the end, with all that
was said and done, they were

624
00:35:12,240 --> 00:35:15,560
happy with what they heard on
the radio, which, you know, is a

625
00:35:15,560 --> 00:35:17,720
good thing.
This was really a five part

626
00:35:17,720 --> 00:35:20,400
story and it had five key
elements.

627
00:35:20,400 --> 00:35:23,760
One was what's at stake that
gives you the reason why

628
00:35:23,760 --> 00:35:26,520
something mattered. 2 is what
kicked it off.

629
00:35:26,520 --> 00:35:28,640
What was the origin moment,
which we talked about?

630
00:35:28,920 --> 00:35:31,960
Then the messy middle, what
wasn't working, the decision

631
00:35:31,960 --> 00:35:34,240
that changed everything, which
is your pivot at the end.

632
00:35:34,240 --> 00:35:37,760
The decision in this case was
adding the acoustic guitar and

633
00:35:37,760 --> 00:35:39,400
then what the finished result
is.

634
00:35:39,400 --> 00:35:41,960
And that's the payoff.
And for this, obviously it was

635
00:35:41,960 --> 00:35:45,400
the song doing really well-being
one that we're listening to

636
00:35:45,400 --> 00:35:48,160
decades after it was created.
That's kind of how you would

637
00:35:48,160 --> 00:35:51,760
story tell something like this.
You'd have those five parts and

638
00:35:51,760 --> 00:35:54,920
then I know Sid wanted to speak.
I actually had a question for

639
00:35:54,920 --> 00:35:57,840
Ashley before we head out.
There's the resident musician

640
00:35:57,840 --> 00:36:01,600
and songwriter.
How do you know when a song is

641
00:36:01,600 --> 00:36:04,520
done?
Like he talked about, the song

642
00:36:04,520 --> 00:36:06,200
is done.
This is it, we're moving on.

643
00:36:06,200 --> 00:36:08,520
How do you know?
Like, is there a feeling, a

644
00:36:08,520 --> 00:36:11,040
sign?
Is it just like how do you know

645
00:36:11,040 --> 00:36:14,520
when a song is done?
Said that is one of the hardest

646
00:36:14,520 --> 00:36:18,240
questions ever.
So I always say when your mix

647
00:36:18,240 --> 00:36:21,840
engineer says it's done, and I
recommend that if you're ever

648
00:36:21,840 --> 00:36:25,440
producing your own music, you
bring in a secondary mix

649
00:36:25,440 --> 00:36:29,400
engineer because you could go on
and on and on forever.

650
00:36:29,400 --> 00:36:32,200
So I would say when the mix
engineer says it's.

651
00:36:32,960 --> 00:36:36,400
And such an interesting question
because easily applied to a

652
00:36:36,400 --> 00:36:41,240
podcast as well, how do we know
when a podcast is actually done

653
00:36:41,240 --> 00:36:45,320
when you know, sure, we can edit
all the way through and then

654
00:36:45,320 --> 00:36:47,480
say, OK, you know that now it's
done.

655
00:36:47,480 --> 00:36:52,240
But for many of us, that edit
can go on and on and on if we

656
00:36:52,240 --> 00:36:54,160
let it.
Ralph, did you want to add

657
00:36:54,160 --> 00:36:55,680
something?
Yeah, I was going to trumpet

658
00:36:55,680 --> 00:36:58,440
what you just said because it
also takes a little bravado, if

659
00:36:58,440 --> 00:37:00,160
you think about it.
Hear this dude driving in his

660
00:37:00,160 --> 00:37:04,600
car, he hears his music on the
radio, and he calls up the DJ

661
00:37:04,600 --> 00:37:06,960
and be like, oh, I don't care if
he kind of like saying, I don't

662
00:37:06,960 --> 00:37:08,720
care if you like it or not.
That was the whole intent.

663
00:37:09,200 --> 00:37:11,400
And I think we can all learn
from that, is that sometimes

664
00:37:11,400 --> 00:37:14,200
we've got to have a little
bravado with our content and be

665
00:37:14,200 --> 00:37:16,440
willing to stand behind and say,
you know, I'm happy with this.

666
00:37:16,440 --> 00:37:18,080
I'm not going to go back and
edit this again.

667
00:37:18,280 --> 00:37:20,280
This is what it is.
If you don't like it, you're not

668
00:37:20,280 --> 00:37:22,240
my audience.
But I think it takes a little

669
00:37:22,240 --> 00:37:25,680
bravado to do that.
I agree with you wholeheartedly.

670
00:37:26,160 --> 00:37:30,120
I think that for me personally,
Jonathan, what makes Song

671
00:37:30,120 --> 00:37:35,360
Exploder an obsession worthy
show isn't just the music,

672
00:37:36,040 --> 00:37:37,960
right?
Sure, the music definitely adds

673
00:37:37,960 --> 00:37:41,720
something to it, but it's it's
also the way that the process is

674
00:37:41,720 --> 00:37:43,800
revealed.
That's why I was asking Sid

675
00:37:44,160 --> 00:37:47,120
about, you know, could you do
this with office furniture?

676
00:37:47,360 --> 00:37:50,680
Because this show takes
listeners inside, like Jonathan

677
00:37:50,680 --> 00:37:54,000
was saying, uncertainty,
decision making, emotional

678
00:37:54,000 --> 00:37:56,440
context.
And it does that with intention

679
00:37:56,440 --> 00:37:59,840
and it does that with structure.
So the big take away here for me

680
00:37:59,840 --> 00:38:03,520
is that sure, people can connect
sometimes with polished results,

681
00:38:03,520 --> 00:38:07,160
but I think that they really
connect with the moments where

682
00:38:07,160 --> 00:38:09,960
things are being figured out,
right?

683
00:38:09,960 --> 00:38:13,960
The stakes matter, the origins
matter, the Jonathan said the

684
00:38:13,960 --> 00:38:18,360
messy middle matters and the
choices that you make along the

685
00:38:18,360 --> 00:38:22,840
way give your story weight.
So for your own podcast, this

686
00:38:22,840 --> 00:38:25,920
doesn't mean you need to change
your topic or format.

687
00:38:25,920 --> 00:38:29,560
Like I'm not suggesting to Sid
to now turn everything around

688
00:38:29,560 --> 00:38:32,040
and do that.
But it does mean that you can

689
00:38:32,040 --> 00:38:35,920
experiment with how much of the
process you let your listeners

690
00:38:35,920 --> 00:38:39,600
hear or what process you're
going to tell them about.

691
00:38:39,960 --> 00:38:43,600
You can explain why something
mattered before you explain how

692
00:38:43,600 --> 00:38:47,240
it worked.
You can frame small decisions as

693
00:38:47,240 --> 00:38:51,520
moments or meaningful moments.
You can let uncertainty live in

694
00:38:51,520 --> 00:38:54,520
the episode long enough for the
listener to feel it with you.

695
00:38:55,360 --> 00:38:58,240
That's what Song Exploder
reminds us of.

696
00:38:58,240 --> 00:39:01,800
It's that trust that's built
through proof.

697
00:39:02,400 --> 00:39:05,080
So when you say something
mattered, you show why.

698
00:39:05,680 --> 00:39:08,400
When you describe a decision,
you let the audience hear it.

699
00:39:09,080 --> 00:39:12,600
That kind of clarity, that kind
of honesty, it makes people want

700
00:39:12,600 --> 00:39:15,680
to come back.
So I think the question to sit

701
00:39:15,680 --> 00:39:19,240
with after today is where can
you let your audience into the

702
00:39:19,240 --> 00:39:22,240
moment that something clicked,
something changed or almost

703
00:39:22,240 --> 00:39:26,920
didn't happen, whether it's your
story or your guest's story.

704
00:39:27,520 --> 00:39:31,640
That's I believe the approach to
take, especially like, since

705
00:39:31,640 --> 00:39:35,720
most of you are a lot of you, I
know, interview people, but you

706
00:39:35,720 --> 00:39:40,440
can apply that logic that Song
Exploder uses to help a guest

707
00:39:40,680 --> 00:39:44,720
tell their story.
Particularly moments where, like

708
00:39:44,720 --> 00:39:48,000
I said, something clicked or
changed or maybe it didn't

709
00:39:48,000 --> 00:39:50,640
happen.
That's what reels an audience

710
00:39:50,640 --> 00:39:52,880
in.
That's what gets them interested

711
00:39:52,880 --> 00:39:56,320
in your guest and interested in
coming back to hear more

712
00:39:56,320 --> 00:40:00,360
episodes with other guests.
I just want to say there's a way

713
00:40:00,360 --> 00:40:02,960
that you can do this.
Instead of just talking about

714
00:40:02,960 --> 00:40:05,440
the steps that you take, ask
them.

715
00:40:05,760 --> 00:40:08,480
If you're interviewing somebody,
ask them questions like what

716
00:40:08,480 --> 00:40:12,320
they believed or what they tried
or what went wrong, because

717
00:40:12,320 --> 00:40:14,880
those are going to bring your
audience into the emotional

718
00:40:14,880 --> 00:40:18,480
process of creating something.
When you ask those questions and

719
00:40:18,480 --> 00:40:22,080
you build out a story in that
way, you're getting much more

720
00:40:22,080 --> 00:40:23,880
emotional.
It's not the process.

721
00:40:23,880 --> 00:40:25,240
Well, what did you do to do
this?

722
00:40:25,240 --> 00:40:27,120
Why?
I got my people together and we

723
00:40:27,280 --> 00:40:30,920
created all the parts of song.
We made a song that's not an

724
00:40:30,920 --> 00:40:34,320
interesting episode, but what
you believed, what you tried,

725
00:40:34,320 --> 00:40:36,760
what went wrong, Those are
that's where the interest comes

726
00:40:36,760 --> 00:40:39,600
in, in the episode.
And I had one thing that I was

727
00:40:39,600 --> 00:40:43,360
going to say about this.
And while appreciating the song

728
00:40:43,360 --> 00:40:48,600
is really important, the power
in this podcast is making all of

729
00:40:48,600 --> 00:40:51,640
the creators feel seen in their
own creative process.

730
00:40:52,200 --> 00:40:56,040
I think that's something that's
really powerful in this podcast.

731
00:40:56,640 --> 00:40:58,480
Yeah, I agree.
Great point, Jonathan.

732
00:40:58,480 --> 00:41:00,840
I think Ashley also wanted to
chime in as well.

733
00:41:00,840 --> 00:41:03,280
Go ahead, Ashley.
I just wanted to chime in also

734
00:41:03,280 --> 00:41:05,480
about the quality of the
questions.

735
00:41:05,720 --> 00:41:09,760
You might not even know that
this podcast had an interview

736
00:41:09,760 --> 00:41:13,240
aspect to it unless they told
you those questions have been

737
00:41:13,240 --> 00:41:16,320
edited out.
But those questions are so good.

738
00:41:16,560 --> 00:41:18,440
We don't need to hear the
interviewer.

739
00:41:18,440 --> 00:41:22,040
And I just think that that all
goes back to considering the

740
00:41:22,040 --> 00:41:24,520
quality of your questions to
carry that narrative.

741
00:41:25,000 --> 00:41:27,400
Yeah.
And it would be so nice for us

742
00:41:27,400 --> 00:41:31,720
as podcasters to hear what those
questions were, right as an as

743
00:41:31,720 --> 00:41:34,200
an audience, Yeah, it doesn't
matter.

744
00:41:34,200 --> 00:41:36,360
I agree.
But as podcasters here breaking

745
00:41:36,360 --> 00:41:40,440
down an obsession worthy show,
it would be really helpful for

746
00:41:40,440 --> 00:41:41,680
us.
But I think you're right, it

747
00:41:41,680 --> 00:41:45,440
does have a lot to do with
asking quality questions.

748
00:41:45,440 --> 00:41:48,520
Yes, Sid, go ahead.
So I was thinking about this.

749
00:41:49,160 --> 00:41:53,480
I wonder if he asked multiple
questions or if he just asked

750
00:41:53,480 --> 00:41:57,000
one question.
He asked one question that said,

751
00:41:57,000 --> 00:42:00,280
tell me about the story of how
you wrote this song.

752
00:42:00,960 --> 00:42:04,720
And he just stopped.
And the artist went on and on

753
00:42:04,720 --> 00:42:06,480
and brought in all these
different things.

754
00:42:06,480 --> 00:42:09,120
And then he got, I mean, I doubt
that's what happened.

755
00:42:09,120 --> 00:42:12,080
But you know, when you think
about the power of this story,

756
00:42:12,080 --> 00:42:16,440
it could have all come from one
really great opening question.

757
00:42:17,440 --> 00:42:21,480
I agree it could.
And my guess is, yeah, it was

758
00:42:21,480 --> 00:42:24,320
more than one question.
The details that they provide, I

759
00:42:24,320 --> 00:42:27,560
would just be shocked if they
just sat there and told the

760
00:42:27,560 --> 00:42:31,080
whole story from start to finish
and the the interviewer just

761
00:42:31,080 --> 00:42:34,800
kind of sat back and listened.
But yeah, those questions,

762
00:42:35,080 --> 00:42:38,960
whatever it is, whether it's one
or fifteen of them, I think that

763
00:42:38,960 --> 00:42:43,600
that's really the key to
delivering quality content to

764
00:42:43,600 --> 00:42:46,000
your audience.
And I'll drive it home again.

765
00:42:46,200 --> 00:42:48,800
I think it's really like
Jonathan was saying, it's more

766
00:42:48,800 --> 00:42:55,400
about the struggle, the wins,
the losses along the way more so

767
00:42:55,400 --> 00:42:57,920
than just here's how we put the
song together.

768
00:42:58,280 --> 00:43:01,000
I think that's really the
probably one of the biggest

769
00:43:01,000 --> 00:43:03,880
takeaways from today's
breakdown.

770
00:43:04,480 --> 00:43:07,680
Speaking of breakdown, as a lot
of, you know, on Thursdays,

771
00:43:08,440 --> 00:43:11,040
although now I think we're going
to do it every other Thursday,

772
00:43:11,440 --> 00:43:14,680
we do evaluations where
somebody, an independent

773
00:43:14,680 --> 00:43:18,520
podcaster submits a podcast
episode for us to share our

774
00:43:18,520 --> 00:43:21,840
thoughts, our feedback,
opinions, etcetera, areas for

775
00:43:21,840 --> 00:43:24,360
improvement, what they're doing
well, etcetera.

776
00:43:24,360 --> 00:43:28,840
And last week, episode 440 of
the podcasting morning chat, we

777
00:43:28,840 --> 00:43:32,720
evaluated Bernie Borge's Life
Fulfilled podcast.

778
00:43:33,400 --> 00:43:38,640
And admittedly, I get nervous
evaluating shows of podcasters

779
00:43:38,640 --> 00:43:41,120
that I know.
Bernie and I don't know each

780
00:43:41,120 --> 00:43:45,360
other super well, but we have a
solid connection and always

781
00:43:45,360 --> 00:43:49,360
enjoy catching up at Podfest.
So last week though, I I was

782
00:43:49,360 --> 00:43:52,000
feeling a little uneasy because
I just don't know how it's going

783
00:43:52,000 --> 00:43:55,080
to be received, especially from
somebody that knows me.

784
00:43:55,080 --> 00:43:57,040
I don't.
I didn't want anyone to get

785
00:43:57,040 --> 00:43:59,480
hurt, right?
Even though I think we do this

786
00:43:59,480 --> 00:44:02,920
in a very tasteful way,
sometimes people can get

787
00:44:02,920 --> 00:44:05,960
offended.
But once again, I wanted to

788
00:44:05,960 --> 00:44:08,600
share that we have another
satisfied listener.

789
00:44:08,600 --> 00:44:12,240
Podcaster Bernie left us a
comment on YouTube.

790
00:44:12,240 --> 00:44:14,120
He left us a comment on
LinkedIn.

791
00:44:14,320 --> 00:44:15,960
And here's what he said on
LinkedIn.

792
00:44:16,160 --> 00:44:19,600
Mark, thanks to you and your
podcasting morning chat team for

793
00:44:19,600 --> 00:44:23,320
the constructive feedback on my
Life Filled podcast.

794
00:44:23,840 --> 00:44:26,920
I listened intently, took many
notes, and have documented

795
00:44:26,920 --> 00:44:31,360
action plans from this feedback.
I've already even updated my

796
00:44:31,400 --> 00:44:33,520
artwork so he's talking about
his cover art.

797
00:44:33,720 --> 00:44:36,120
We had some feedback for him and
I did look at it.

798
00:44:36,400 --> 00:44:39,720
He didn't simplify it.
He did make the name of the

799
00:44:39,720 --> 00:44:47,360
podcast bigger appear bigger on
in that 3000 by 3000 pixel cover

800
00:44:47,360 --> 00:44:49,840
art.
And Sid, I think it was you who

801
00:44:49,840 --> 00:44:53,440
encouraged him that we want to
see him smile and he added a

802
00:44:53,440 --> 00:44:57,360
smiling face to that.
So it's just fun and exciting to

803
00:44:57,360 --> 00:45:02,440
hear podcasters really take what
we share to heart and get

804
00:45:02,440 --> 00:45:05,840
excited about it and go and
instantly make changes.

805
00:45:06,520 --> 00:45:10,280
So if you're interested in
having your podcast evaluated,

806
00:45:11,240 --> 00:45:14,240
Ashley will put in the show
notes for you, a link to the

807
00:45:14,240 --> 00:45:18,080
application to apply.
We'd have not picked somebody

808
00:45:18,080 --> 00:45:21,480
for next Thursday, a week from
this coming Thursday.

809
00:45:21,680 --> 00:45:26,200
So if you want to be thrown into
that pool, we could pick yours

810
00:45:26,200 --> 00:45:29,080
for this very next evaluation
episode.

811
00:45:29,080 --> 00:45:32,240
So come check that out.
And Jonathan, thank you again

812
00:45:32,920 --> 00:45:38,440
for a wonderful breakdown of
what what makes these obsession

813
00:45:38,440 --> 00:45:42,000
worthy podcasts so obsession
worthy.

814
00:45:43,520 --> 00:45:46,080
And we'll look forward to doing
it again next week.

815
00:45:46,080 --> 00:45:49,520
So if there are, if there's a
popular podcast episode that

816
00:45:49,520 --> 00:45:52,600
you're interested in that you
want us to break down, let us

817
00:45:52,600 --> 00:45:55,200
know about it and we'll throw it
by Jonathan.

818
00:45:55,200 --> 00:45:58,840
But he has a whole arsenal of
different shows and episodes

819
00:45:58,840 --> 00:46:01,880
that we can break down for you
as well.

820
00:46:02,320 --> 00:46:03,640
That's going to do it for this
week.

821
00:46:03,640 --> 00:46:06,480
Reminder that we are here
usually every Monday through

822
00:46:06,480 --> 00:46:09,960
Friday, 7:00 AM Eastern, unless
weather or illness or something

823
00:46:09,960 --> 00:46:13,600
out of the ordinary stops us.
You can listen to us live on

824
00:46:13,600 --> 00:46:17,960
Clubhouse, YouTube, Facebook,
LinkedIn, all the places we put

825
00:46:17,960 --> 00:46:20,320
all those links in the show
notes.

826
00:46:20,320 --> 00:46:22,480
Ralph, did you want to add
something before we wrap up?

827
00:46:22,840 --> 00:46:25,560
Yeah, I just wanted to add one
thing, and we learned this from

828
00:46:25,560 --> 00:46:27,040
Bernie.
Actually, Bernie reached out to

829
00:46:27,040 --> 00:46:28,280
me.
He reached out to Sid on

830
00:46:28,280 --> 00:46:30,080
LinkedIn.
One of the things I'm going to

831
00:46:30,080 --> 00:46:32,600
tell people is in this
community, reach out to other

832
00:46:32,600 --> 00:46:35,800
people in the community and
connect with them on LinkedIn

833
00:46:35,800 --> 00:46:38,840
and other platforms because you
can learn a great deal from

834
00:46:38,840 --> 00:46:40,600
other people.
And it's just a great way to

835
00:46:40,600 --> 00:46:42,480
build this community.
So Mark, I just wanted to add to

836
00:46:42,480 --> 00:46:45,200
that because, you know, it's
just because we had them on the

837
00:46:45,200 --> 00:46:48,120
show is now I have a connection.
So I just want to thank you for

838
00:46:48,120 --> 00:46:49,080
that.
And I just want to encourage

839
00:46:49,080 --> 00:46:52,160
everybody else that to make that
grow your, your, your people in

840
00:46:52,160 --> 00:46:54,680
your community as well.
Such a great point.

841
00:46:54,680 --> 00:46:57,080
Thank you, Ralph.
I appreciate that and cool to

842
00:46:57,080 --> 00:47:00,200
hear that Bernie reached out to
you and Sid as well.

843
00:47:00,640 --> 00:47:03,360
Thank you all for doing such
great work and really serving

844
00:47:03,360 --> 00:47:06,360
this independent podcaster
community.

845
00:47:06,440 --> 00:47:10,640
Really appreciate you as well.
So we're back tomorrow, 7:00 AM

846
00:47:10,640 --> 00:47:14,160
Eastern, covering all the news
and headlines around the world

847
00:47:14,160 --> 00:47:16,600
of podcasting.
We'll talk about them and how

848
00:47:16,600 --> 00:47:20,280
they might affect us as
podcasters and content creators.

849
00:47:20,480 --> 00:47:25,280
Join us tomorrow and until then,
make it a great day everybody

850
00:47:25,440 --> 00:47:25,880
take care.